VADCFLL-L Archives

First Lego League in Virginia and DC


Options: Use Classic View

Use Monospaced Font
Show HTML Part by Default
Condense Mail Headers

Topic: [<< First] [< Prev] [Next >] [Last >>]

Print Reply
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="001a11c32c822cb6580507aa32f8"
Sender: First Lego League in Virginia and DC <[log in to unmask]>
From: VA-DC Referee Advisor <[log in to unmask]>
Date: Wed, 12 Nov 2014 09:27:31 -0500
In-Reply-To: <[log in to unmask]>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Reply-To: VA-DC Referee Advisor <[log in to unmask]>
Parts/Attachments: text/plain (7 kB) , text/html (11 kB)
Hal is pretty close on his understanding.

It's always okay to prepare and load stuff during the pre-match preparation
period (Rule 36--you may store and arrange equipment, load the robot, get
everything into starting position"), so that includes the two people
minifigs, since they start out in Base.

Update 7 is actually even more relaxed.  To get 20 points for the
Apprenticeship model, it only needs to be shown to the referee while in an
allowable Rule 35 storage area, which includes Base and also places
entirely off the table:
--in a box or tray on a stand
--held by members away from the table (should only apply to team-supplied
objects--mission models are worth points)

Update 7 also clarifies that the team doesn't even need to attach the
people to earn the first 20 points.

Steve Scherr
VA-DC FLL Referee Advisor

On Wed, Nov 12, 2014 at 12:03 AM, Hal Swetnam <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> So am I reading update #7 correctly? The minifigs can be attached at any
> time (before the match starts?) and must simply be in base and visible to
> the judges for the team to score the 20 pts?
> You arrive at the table with your Apprenticeship model already built. You
> may add the people to it by hand, any time, including prematch
> setup. Just by having the model in view of the referee (in Base or any
> other Rule 35 storage area) you get 20 points. To get 35
> points instead, bind the people to it, and have the robot place
> Brick Bandits
> On Nov 10, 2014, at 3:17 PM, Stephen Scherr <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
> Yes, I am saying exactly that.  Your team doesn't need any people at all
> to earn 20 points, but must sacrifice the 2 seconds needed to attach the
> table-supplied people from Base in order to earn 35 points.
> Your team may bring as many Star Wars, Harry Potter, and other general
> LEGO people as they want, as long as they aren't the same as the two in
> Base.  The update says "... if they aren't duplicates of this year's
> mission model people."  So no--you may not bring the two people from your
> field kit to the table.
> Steve
> On Mon, Nov 10, 2014 at 12:27 PM, Hal Swetnam <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>> Hi there
>> just trying to figure out the rules on Apprenticeship.  Are you saying
>> that to get the full 35 points the team has to use the mini figures
>> provided by the tournament? I thought they could bring their own? Is it a
>> matter of getting full points?
>> Thanks for any clarification.  Here was the latest update we saw:
>> 30 – APPRENTICESHIP PEOPLE, WHITE CIRCLE Update 25 was meant to remind
>> you about Rule 18, Exception 2. You ARE allowed to arrive with people as
>> part of your model, if they aren’t duplicates of this year’s mission model
>> people. (Clarification of Update 25) Of the two interpretations of what
>> could be meant by “white circle,” area vs perimeter, the area is what
>> matters. So if your model ends up touching only the interior, and not the
>> edge, that’s okay. (Apprenticeship clarification)
>> Thanks!
>> The Brick Bandits
>> On Nov 9, 2014, at 11:32 PM, VA-DC Referee Advisor <[log in to unmask]>
>> wrote:
>> We had 8 FLL tournaments in Virginia this weekend, and it looks like
>> teams had a great time.  I know that the referees were impressed at all the
>> creative solutions teams found to accomplish their selected missions, and
>> I've heard good things from the judges too.  I hope that the week 1
>> activity during core values judging helped to raise everyone's expectations!
>> There a few things that surprised some teams at the robot game tables,
>> that I would like to give teams a heads-up about.
>> First a reminder--don't trust any pictures or video unless the text of
>> the Robot Game agrees with them.  According to Rule 5:
>> "When there is conflict between pictures/videos and text, the text takes
>> precedence!"
>> 1)  Engagement mission setup
>>     According to the Field Setup, and Game Update 5, the engagement
>> pinwheel setup is with its red arm up.  (That means that the main body of
>> the arm points straight up.)  Both pictures on pages 10 and 29 are
>> incorrect.
>> 2)  Bouncing the Sports Ball
>>     Teams at several tournaments discovered that the blue ball may not
>> bounce the same on competition or practice tables as it does on the table
>> that they practiced on.  I know that at some tournaments, there was a
>> mixture of behaviors among both the competition and practice tables.  We're
>> sorry about this unexpected behavior, but it is covered by Rule 4,
>> Variability, and no team will know what to expect until they get to the
>> table.
>> 3)  Ramming the Door
>>     As described in the mission and rules, the team doesn't get points
>> for opening the door by ramming it and breaking it.  You must push down on
>> the handle to allow the door to open.
>> 4)  Loop in the Senses mission
>>     Update 32 was a little too subtle about the loop in the Using the
>> Right Senses mission.  The mission requirement is that the loop is
>> "released" only by pushing the slider.  The update says not to expect the
>> the loop will be "ejected" by using the slider.  The update is also trying
>> to say that "release" means "to allow to be moved or taken", so, once your
>> robot pushes the slider to lift the weight out of the way, the robot is
>> allowed to remove the loop from the model.
>> 5)  Reverse Engineering--making the original model during setup
>>     Your team is required to build an original model out of all 6 pieces
>> when they get to the table, even if they don't plan to do the Reverse
>> Engineering.  See the Field Setup, and Updates 14 and 24.  The two Robot
>> Handlers are the only ones allowed to build the model.   Being prepared for
>> this is part of being a Gracious Professional.
>> 6)  Apprenticeship--try it out!
>>     If your team isn't doing the Apprenticeship mission, they really
>> should take a look at Update 7
>> 7)  Apprenticeship People
>>     As discussed earlier today, your team is required to use the people
>> at the table in order to score full points on the Apprenticeship mission.
>> 8)  Kidnapping
>>     Please be careful, both at the competition tables and the practice
>> tables, that you don't take any mission models, such as the people or the
>> blue ball.  If you discover them, take them back immediately.  Removing
>> them hurts other teams, and thus is against Gracious Professionalism.
>>     You shouldn't bring the Apprenticeship people from your practice kit,
>> and you should avoid bringing any blue balls, if at all possible.
>> Tournament volunteers will think that they belong to the tournament kits,
>> and will ask you to hand them over.
>> Best wishes to all FLL teams in the upcoming weeks!
>> Steve Scherr
>> Virginia-DC FLL Referee Advisor
>>   ------------------------------
>> To UNSUBSCRIBE or CHANGE your settings, please visit
>> and select "Join or
>> leave the list".
>> VADCFLL administrative announcements are sent via
>> to
>> subscribe.
>> ------------------------------
>> To UNSUBSCRIBE or CHANGE your settings, please visit
>> and select "Join or
>> leave the list".
>> VADCFLL administrative announcements are sent via
>> to
>> subscribe.
> ------------------------------
> To UNSUBSCRIBE or CHANGE your settings, please visit
> and select "Join or
> leave the list".
> VADCFLL administrative announcements are sent via VADCFLL-ANNOUNCEMENTS-L.
> Visit to
> subscribe.

-- To UNSUBSCRIBE or CHANGE your settings, please visit and select "Join or leave the list".

-- VADCFLL administrative announcements are sent via VADCFLL-ANNOUNCEMENTS-L. Visit to subscribe.