Annette, Thanks for sharing your thoughts on posting FLL scores. The posting of scores is a topic which seems to come up each year, and there are many good opinions. Some coaches feel *all* scores should be posted, some coaches feel *no* scores should be posted, and many coaches feel somewhere in between. I'd like to reply to your thoughtful suggestion in a few parts: 1. FIRST Philosophy about Awards: I am a FLL Coach (in my 4th year), and I have also volunteered as a judge at FVC (the precursor to FTC) events (at tournaments in Florida)... the FIRST philosophy, as I understand it, is to give the awards for the judged categories to as many different teams as possible. Thus, one team will not receive two awards for two judged categories, (i.e., Presentation, Robot Design & Teamwork). This is intended to motivate as many kids excited as possible to enjoy the experience, and to have as many teams as possible feel good about their work. The exception to this rule is the Robot Performance awards, since the Robot Performance scores are posted publicly, so even if a team wins an award for a judged category, they can also win an award for Robot Performance. When I judged, there were a few teams which could easily have taken 1st or 2nd place in almost every category, but that would not make the other teams feel good, so FIRST has things set up so that the judges deliberate, and select no more than one (judged) award per team. If the judging sessions' scores were posted at all, then at some tournaments, a few teams would dominate, and get most of the awards. Thus, the judging scores are kept private, so that the awards, for the judged categories, can be distributed to as many teams as possible. Whether one agrees with this approach or not, this is the FIRST philosophy, as I understand it. (Personally, I like the FIRST way of giving awards to as many teams as possible.) 2. Judged Events: These aren't really a regular sporting game, like soccer or baseball. The opinions of the judges enter into the judged scores, and there's no way around that. In this sense, the judged events are more like figure skating or gymnastics scores. Some people feel that a judged event is or is not really a sporting event like a game ... thus, posting judged scores is an area of contention. Again, I do like the FIRST way of giving awards to as many teams as possible, and keeping the judged scores *not* posted, is one way to accomplish this. 3. FLL Policy Decisions Come From the Top: FLL is not a democracy, and that's okay with me (most of the time). I'm in my 4th year of coaching FLL, and one thing I've learned about FLL, is that the important policy decisions about things like what the public is allowed to see (for example: judged sessions & judged scores), are all decided at the top of the leadership structure. If you can convince the state leadership, you may have a chance of implementing a change. Perhaps the state leadership might change something if enough coaches requested it, but I have found that the volunteers who run the state organizations are passionate folks who are doing work which they feel strongly about, and they really are doing what they believe is right for the children. And that seems to include *not* posting the judged scores. I respect the amazing dedication, leadership and passion for helping the children, which our state organizers display regularly. However, I can't recall even one time that they changed a significant policy decision, due to input from coaches (I will apologize if I'm wrong about this). I am impressed that the state organizers can find enough common ground, among all of us, to keep FLL going. They are doing an awesome job, and they have my appreciation. I wish you luck in your effort to make FLL even better. Thanks, Kevin Kevin Hines FLL Coach [log in to unmask] www.RoanokeRobotics.org -----Original Message----- From: First Lego League Discussion [mailto:[log in to unmask]]On Behalf Of Annette Holloway Sent: Saturday, November 22, 2008 11:13 AM To: [log in to unmask] Subject: [VADCFLL-L] Tournament Scoring Just some thoughts about the emphasis on scores - I think it would be nice to have rankings displayed briefly at the end of the tournament for every judging category, and possibly have awards for the second & third place as well. That way the Lego table does not appear to be the most important thing. Our team did incredibly well on their project, did not win an award, but it would have been very encouraging to know if they were second. That additional feedback would be helpful for upcoming years. Annette Holloway NASA Ninjas Hampton, Va ______________________________________________________________ To UNSUBSCRIBE or CHANGE YOUR SETTINGS, please visit https://listserv.jmu.edu/archives/vadcfll-l.html and select "Join or leave the list". If you want to join the VADCFLL-ADMIN-L mailing list - to which FLL administrative announcements will be distributed - visit https://listserv.jmu.edu/archives/vadcfll-admin-l.html and select "Join or leave the list". ______________________________________________________________ To UNSUBSCRIBE or CHANGE YOUR SETTINGS, please visit https://listserv.jmu.edu/archives/vadcfll-l.html and select "Join or leave the list". If you want to join the VADCFLL-ADMIN-L mailing list - to which FLL administrative announcements will be distributed - visit https://listserv.jmu.edu/archives/vadcfll-admin-l.html and select "Join or leave the list".