What if the robot delivers the bike/la
ptop/insulation and stops?  That would 
make the robot inactive.  The kids could retrieve the robot.  So long as the 
scoring items are not attached and remain in a scoring position they should get 
points - and lose a levy as a penalty.

I've seen some teams who would rather take the penalty point deduction than 
waste time letting the robot drive back to base.  Even though I don't agree with 
the technique, I don't think the rules prohibit it - they just assess penalty 
points against them for the method.

-----Original Message-----
From: Steve Scherr [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 10:47 PM
To: [log in to unmask]; Swayne, Nick
Subject: Re: active touch rule

I have to agree with Mark.

If the robot is still pushing the insulation blocks (or other objects) when the 
robot or objects are
touched, then it is still in contact with them (see Loss of Contact rule)

The Active Robot Touched rule, and Q&A Ruling 32 make it clear that the blocks 
would either be
removed from the field (if they contacted the robot out of Base), or returned to 
Base (if they have
been in continuous contact with the robot since it was started).

Under this year's rules, no movable object in contact with an active robot when 
it is touched will
stay in place on the field.

Steve

On Thu, 13 Nov 2008 10:52:42
 -0500, Swayne, Nick <[log in to unmask]> wrote:

>Mark,
>
>I don't think this is the intent of the rule - but I am not a lawyer.
>
>If the robot does something (like collect the carbon balls) and gets stuck or 
stops on the field -
if the robot is touched and returned to base - those things it had already 
collected are removed
from play and the team gets a penalty.
>
>If the insulation blocks are in contact with the mat and were simply pushed out 
- then the robot
stops and is retrieved by hand - there should be a penalty but the yellow blocks 
would remain on
the table.
>
>From: First Lego League Discussion [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On 
Behalf Of
Mark FLL Allen
>Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 10:27 AM
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Subject: Re: [VADCFLL-L] active touch rule
>
>See the answers as I understand the rules below.  One other scenario:
>
>Robot delivers insulation to scoring area but the robot is touched while still 
in contact.  As I
understand it there are actually two answers;
>
>1) Robot contacted the object on the field and moved it to the scoring area.  
The object(s) are
removed by the ref and are out of play.
>2) Robot previously brought those objects back to base.  If so, those objects 
are
 returned to
base.
>
>Does every one agree?
>
>Best regards,
>Mark
>-----Original Message-----
>From: David Levy <[log in to unmask]>
>To: [log in to unmask]
>Sent: Thu, 13 Nov 2008 9:53 am
>Subject: Re: [VADCFLL-L] active touch rule
>Maybe some example scenarios would be appropriate -
>
>In the "testing the levees challenge" , robot has moved only partially out of 
base - robot is
touched when:
>
>1) still not yet reached the challenge model (penalty ?)  - No penalty.
>2) challenge model has been activated , and other end of robot is sitting on 
the challenge
model's activation bar ( penalty ?) No Penalty
>3) challenge model has been activated, robot has moved off challenge model's 
activation bar and
'heading' back ( legal ?) No penalty
>
>In other missions where the robot has completely left base performed a mission 
and is returning
to base - robot is touched when:
>4) robot is completely in base but still rolling ( legal )  Yes - legal
>5) robot is partially in base but still rolling ( legal ) Yes - legal
>6) robot is partially in base but it is bringing back a scoring object that is 
on a section of the
robot that has not crossed over the home base line. (penalty?)  No penalty but 
the "retrievable" is
removed from the table by the ref and is o
ut of play.
>
>thanks
>David
>
>Darlene Pantaleo wrote:
>> Normally you can touch the robot while in base, but if you do it while > it 
is performing a
mission, then the mission will not count. The new > rules allow for performing a 
mission without
leaving the base. Sorry > for the confusion.
>> Darlene Pantaleo
>> Judge Advisor
>> Maggie Walker
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Nov 13, 2008, at 2:52 AM, Michael Blanpied wrote:
>>
>>> Dear Darlene,
>>>
>>>> The effect of the new rules is on what the robot can do while in >>> base. 
It does not
effect a team's touching the robot except that a >>> mission will not count if 
done from base
(such as the "test the >>> levees" challenge).
>>>
>>> I'm afraid I don't understand what that last phrase means. Under what >> 
circumstance
would a mission not count? Thanks for clarifying.
>>>
>>> -- >> Cheers,
>>> Mike Blanpied
>>> Reston, VA
>>> 2006 Nano People #4809
>>> 2007 Power Bunnies #1666
>>> 2008 BLT - Brilliant Lego Team #5013
>>
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