I've yet to find the words to say or thoughts to think to be sure these
resented tree-names are cut down...but my guess is that when they are cut
down, the hostage-holding checker will go with it, because checking seems
to be a part of the cycle of bringing the egoic bloodsport back..

I typically just remain still, and trust presence to eventually wash it
away, but my momentum as a scientist ....says to be quiet.

On Wed, Sep 22, 2021 at 5:57 AM Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx <
[log in to unmask]> wrote:

> Excellent reflections, Jamie.  I am traveling, but wanted to say that.
>
> Best,
> Gregg
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Sep 22, 2021, at 6:25 AM, Jamie D <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>  *CAUTION: *This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click
> links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the
> content is safe.
> ------------------------------
> More difficult is how one reconciles all this with justice.
>
> Atoms and genes are words that correspond with their reference ‘point’ in
> the system that corresponds with worldly experience.
>
> Set theory is a means of making the (imagined) world ‘one’ …as in ‘one set
> of clothes’
>
> But how about names of people?
>
> I’ve had years of momentum in resentments towards specific words, which I
> now realize as having neurolinguistically programmed myself …  and my guess
> is that these ‘programs’ are ontological trees of mistaken judgements that
> can be cut down….*zip-it *(comes to mind at the end)
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 21, 2021 at 5:33 AM Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx <
> [log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> Thanks for these thoughts. I am traveling currently, so I will be brief.
>>
>> First, the idea of generating robot overlords does not sound like the
>> wisest possible course of action to me. I also am quite skeptical of that.
>>
>> The UTOK strongly suggests that what we are looking at is a merger of the
>> Culture Person plane with the emergence of a
>> Digital-Virtual-Social-Technological interface. That is, the new phase will
>> be much more about human-Digital cyborgs and fusions across multiple
>> landscapes.
>>
>> This will be a time of incredible change. Moreover, the strong conclusion
>> from the metacrisis is that more technological-instrumental power without
>> wisdom in understanding humanity, nature and our place in the cosmos is
>> very likely going to accelerate the Titanic toward the iceberg. It is clear
>> that digital tech will continue to evolve, as that is the nature of
>> complexification and human drives for more power and efficiency. The key,
>> IMO, is whether we can actually wake up and consciously evolve toward
>> cultivating wisdom energy rather than instrumental power.
>>
>> Best,
>> Gregg
>>
>>
>> ______________________________________________________________________
>> Gregg Henriques, Ph.D.
>> Professor
>> Director, C-I Doc Program
>> Department of Graduate Psychology
>> 216 Johnston Hall
>> MSC 7401
>> James Madison University
>> Harrisonburg, VA 22807
>> (540) 568-7857 (phone)
>> (540) 568-4747 (fax)
>>
>> *Be that which enhances dignity and well-being with integrity.*
>>
>>
>> Check out my Theory of Knowledge blog at Psychology Today at:
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.psychologytoday.com_blog_theory-2Dknowledge&d=DwIFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=RlkCOTkkHn67wP6vB8u6qL9kPEWvdkroUwZmOfbrlzE&s=BhUyMVSavhnNJQ5XmCVwoY3mJoRqMPq24YSHy06X9eE&e= 
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.psychologytoday.com_blog_theory-2Dknowledge&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=_5uGl5ECFK7trTfKi7uuXV3DW1l1O4QnOAtIEMXQ2mw&s=HrNzu0xnHnVLQQhFQdwrtu6TrcfQJsvMe5kk24OkvwA&e=>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> *From:* tree of knowledge system discussion <
>> [log in to unmask]> on behalf of James Gien Wong <
>> [log in to unmask]>
>> *Sent:* Monday, September 20, 2021 11:45 AM
>> *To:* [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
>> *Subject:* Re: TOK This article seems to point to a confusion of
>> interlevel causation
>>
>> *CAUTION: *This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links
>> or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is
>> safe.
>> ------------------------------
>> That almost sounds like human-designed, machine eugenics where machines
>> that we have taught make predictions of optimal human behavior and the
>> genes that lead to those behaviors. Yet humans have demonstrated time and
>> time again that our limited knowledge of the universe consistently results
>> in unintended consequences, progress traps. And as we increase the
>> firepower of our technological prowess, we also increase the impact of our
>> progress traps (witness climate change induced by burning fossil fuels - an
>> unintended consequence of internal combustion engines). If AI is predicated
>> on models of imperfect human intelligence, they will naturally inherit all
>> our cognitive limitations. The wisdom of giving AI too much control when
>> their machine intelligence is predicated on imperfect human knowledge is
>> not a comforting thought.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Sep 20, 2021 at 2:44 PM James Lyons-Weiler <
>> [log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>> *CAUTION: *This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links
>> or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is
>> safe.
>> ------------------------------
>> Well put, Gregg.
>>
>> What does TOK say about future SuperAI - generated concepts and methods
>> that lead to genetic manipulation of humans?
>>
>> In my analysis, since SuperAI is ultimately our creation, it might appear
>> to be endogenous.
>>
>> However, once is starts autonomously developing rules, laws, concepts,
>> languages, and imposing those construct on humanity, or rewriting our
>> genetics
>> to make us fit its needs,  from the perspective of the integrity of our
>> species, it becomes
>> and exogenous force (threat).
>>
>> And if we join a Super-AI as Musk suggests, the schism in humanity will
>> pale
>> in comparison to any in the past.
>>
>> The reality of other, non-human intelligence should but fit into U-ToK if
>> it can be.
>>
>> Do the UToK descriptors "justifications" fit into an entire SuperAI
>> -generated conceptual framework?
>>
>> Or is UToK relevant to human consciousness alone?
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Sep 20, 2021 at 6:12 AM Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx <
>> [log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>> Hi James,
>>
>>  Thanks. I agree with you fully about interlevel causation. This is
>> something UTOK tries to help folks get clear about. Indeed, in the UTOK’s
>> taxonomy of science given by the ToK into Periodic Table of
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__medium.com_unified-2Dtheory-2Dof-2Dknowledge_the-2D12-2Dfloors-2Dof-2Dscience-2D9c2c485df315&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=68GqiqnVNKPwczaRV5phJnJyi4UrlhmfT2PIAftbnLE&s=T8sXWoeJvuUnVNWWr0XHMw0uCeN4B17HgNw2JF1gP20&e=>
>> Behavior
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__medium.com_unified-2Dtheory-2Dof-2Dknowledge_the-2D12-2Dfloors-2Dof-2Dscience-2D9c2c485df315&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=68GqiqnVNKPwczaRV5phJnJyi4UrlhmfT2PIAftbnLE&s=T8sXWoeJvuUnVNWWr0XHMw0uCeN4B17HgNw2JF1gP20&e=>
>> (attached), your analogy is good, but not quite what UTOK gives. Rather, it
>> is cells (floor 5) that are Life’s equivalent of atoms (floor 2) at the
>> Matter level. The reason is that both cells and atoms are primary units of
>> organization. Genes are the fundamental “digits of biological information”
>> and correspond to Floor 4, and are akin to subatomic particles (floor 1).
>>
>>
>>
>> Not sure if you saw that Lee B. posted this article earlier. My reply was:
>>
>>
>>
>> *“If anyone believes either that “genetics determines all/there are
>> one-to-one gene-behavior relations” OR that “genetics have nothing to do
>> with our talents, dispositions, or proclivities,” then they simply are not
>> educated in the science of (mental) behavior.”*
>>
>>
>>
>> Both atoms and genes are justifications/constructions, so long as that is
>> the referent point we mean in the semiotic triangle (i.e., our human
>> constructions versus the referent). Of course, they are also both
>> scientific ontological concepts that refer to things in the ontic reality
>> (i.e., they are not *just* justifications/constructions, which is what
>> something like a fictitious novel is).
>>
>>
>>
>> I fully agree with you about knowledge helping us to depolarize society,
>> I welcome any opportunity to help people start on a journey of awakening to
>> the truth. Moralizing about genetics, either as entities that determine
>> human behavior or as inevitably dangerous concepts that lead us to Nazism
>> are not pathways to the truth.
>>
>>
>> Best,
>> Gregg
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* tree of knowledge system discussion <
>> [log in to unmask]> *On Behalf Of *James Gien Wong
>> *Sent:* Monday, September 20, 2021 4:48 AM
>> *To:* [log in to unmask]
>> *Subject:* This article seems to point to a confusion of interlevel
>> causation
>>
>>
>>
>> *CAUTION: *This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links
>> or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is
>> safe.
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Obviously a very touchy subject...
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.newyorker.com_magazine_2021_09_13_can-2Dprogressives-2Dbe-2Dconvinced-2Dthat-2Dgenetics-2Dmatters_amp-3Ffbclid-3DIwAR1qqy381NHVB-2DY1Tpexr0tKjLHktn-2DGATmvTOKW88MAXCU5Y7bTI8KMyxo&d=DwIFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=RlkCOTkkHn67wP6vB8u6qL9kPEWvdkroUwZmOfbrlzE&s=ssSWJ0-a6Dfsf7n7RktqajCaiZIiRARogCOj-JLMgOc&e= 
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.newyorker.com_magazine_2021_09_13_can-2Dprogressives-2Dbe-2Dconvinced-2Dthat-2Dgenetics-2Dmatters_amp-3Ffbclid-3DIwAR1qqy381NHVB-2DY1Tpexr0tKjLHktn-2DGATmvTOKW88MAXCU5Y7bTI8KMyxo&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=uoJ3BDErbFc-Rl-kStOpfwFglWLuGVx9pX6yPoM3uLc&s=vp_NlzLtB_z6ws3pp5FfWkzoos8cjsUq0Mn1FlBARn8&e=>
>>
>>
>>
>> The thought that occurred to me, from this forum’s perspective is that
>> genes are the biological equivalent of atoms for the physical universe -
>> genes are the reductionist atoms for the biological universe. Just as it is
>> quite difficult to generalize causality arguments of quantum effects
>> observed at subatomic scales to ones at human/ macroscopic scale, it is
>> difficult to generalize  observations at the bio-molecular level to the
>> human psychological level.
>>
>>
>>
>> Perhaps a ToK framing of the problem can enlighten both polarized sides
>> of this contentious argument?
>>
>>
>>
>> Both atoms and genes are the result of constructed, scientific human
>> narratives. It seems to me that the psychological unpacking of how we
>> humans construct stories is critical for our collective survival at this
>> time. From climate change to vaccines to behavior genetics, it’s our
>> constructed and divergent storytelling that lay at the center of the storm.
>> A deep understanding of how we emerge and use language to construct our
>> stories seems highly salient to depolarizing society.
>>
>> --
>>
>> Wishing you WELLth
>>
>> Gien
>>
>> Future Ancestor
>>
>>
>>
>> Pull a thread here and you’ll find it’s attached to the rest of the
>> world. - Nadeem Aslam
>>
>>
>>
>> www.stopresetgo.org
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.stopresetgo.org_&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=uoJ3BDErbFc-Rl-kStOpfwFglWLuGVx9pX6yPoM3uLc&s=e3gUspWg-dOstCHEqiEFOBGrFwMJtMEadNjykRz6cg0&e=>
>>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.earthwisecentre.org_tps&d=DwIFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=RlkCOTkkHn67wP6vB8u6qL9kPEWvdkroUwZmOfbrlzE&s=oEeFRNtbF_72eypFU_Ixk-YD34tgl7S2-dzmpyb7RIc&e= 
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.earthwisecentre.org_tps&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=uoJ3BDErbFc-Rl-kStOpfwFglWLuGVx9pX6yPoM3uLc&s=pajcYTzKQzM0XWXVWAhjXyxmwa8z8A83YivAtY5AY_0&e=>
>>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__tippingpointfestival.org&d=DwIFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=RlkCOTkkHn67wP6vB8u6qL9kPEWvdkroUwZmOfbrlzE&s=K3zfU64f0X_CryA70tjUmP9ukSA4LVPLPkibiTmi8TI&e= 
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__tippingpointfestival.org_&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=uoJ3BDErbFc-Rl-kStOpfwFglWLuGVx9pX6yPoM3uLc&s=XiDkQVD2qFP-Z24ytKfRpBeNCnftqin5q5RoxjhM5uo&e=>
>>
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.earthwisecentre.org_music-2Dfor-2Dchange&d=DwIFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=RlkCOTkkHn67wP6vB8u6qL9kPEWvdkroUwZmOfbrlzE&s=YnzAK9aWklVvugYYVNmOTcnxCOQWFtccwVGHfi7L32w&e= 
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.earthwisecentre.org_music-2Dfor-2Dchange&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=uoJ3BDErbFc-Rl-kStOpfwFglWLuGVx9pX6yPoM3uLc&s=Pm0qMyngmftZSbHGPUbPnnKYDvWtW972GHge6m6g2N0&e=>
>>
>> www.futureliving.institute
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.futureliving.institute_&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=uoJ3BDErbFc-Rl-kStOpfwFglWLuGVx9pX6yPoM3uLc&s=sgEgaoBiMYZeaDWsbUThtz37WlJe5KIw9AEfT-qMrac&e=>
>>
>> [log in to unmask]
>>
>> intl ph: (1) 206 973-3924
>>
>> SA ph: (+27) 79 589 6173
>>
>> skype: geniepop
>>
>>
>>
>> ############################
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> ---
>> james lyons-weiler, phd
>> Author, CEO, President, Scientist
>> Editor-in-Chief, Science, Public Health Policy, and the Law
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.publichealthpolicyjournal.com_&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=68GqiqnVNKPwczaRV5phJnJyi4UrlhmfT2PIAftbnLE&s=sE4wHQlsMuBaapUHGJEKDjum2bNdqWAIMdPIqQZDqtY&e=>
>> Guest Contributor, Children's Health Defense
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__childrenshealthdefense.org&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=68GqiqnVNKPwczaRV5phJnJyi4UrlhmfT2PIAftbnLE&s=oyr2VaKcSQAK2g5QwofgA2m7DSkumNbWijhQEfRIPh4&e=>
>>
>> The Environmental and Genetic Causes of Autism
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__amzn.to_1KNSxPp&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=68GqiqnVNKPwczaRV5phJnJyi4UrlhmfT2PIAftbnLE&s=jzmeTN-wNgPa3vw8CmPP0-t8omHFQHoBS8y_C-4DPaI&e=>
>> (Skyhorse Publishing)
>> Cures vs. Profits: Successes in Translational Research
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.amazon.com_gp_product_9814730149_ref-3Das-5Fli-5Fqf-5Fsp-5Fasin-5Fil-5Ftl-3Fie-3DUTF8-26camp-3D1789-26creative-3D9325-26creativeASIN-3D9814730149-26linkCode-3Das2-26tag-3Dlivgrelivwel-2D20&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=68GqiqnVNKPwczaRV5phJnJyi4UrlhmfT2PIAftbnLE&s=AgmvgAph2o-FC_Xglg0KvhLKBfWPuvGhshMCyaWzTP0&e=> (World
>> Scientific, 2016)
>> Ebola: An Evolving Story
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__amzn.to_1TGYY9r&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=68GqiqnVNKPwczaRV5phJnJyi4UrlhmfT2PIAftbnLE&s=_WP51TPU78OAuQ6MIxUFYZ4NcU7GnfV5UIhJ4dAAzFs&e=>
>> (World Scientific, 2015)
>> cell 412-728-8743
>> email [log in to unmask]
>> www.*linkedin*.com/in/*jameslyonsweiler*
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.linkedin.com_in_jameslyonsweiler&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=68GqiqnVNKPwczaRV5phJnJyi4UrlhmfT2PIAftbnLE&s=iBWBUHoNTpiPyHBNEHaA9YMko-H1NaI7WIfnB52cgRE&e=>
>> ############################
>>
>> To unsubscribe from the TOK-SOCIETY-L list: write to:
>> mailto:[log in to unmask] or click the
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>> ############################
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> --
> -Jamie
> ############################
>
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-- 
-Jamie

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