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Subject: Re: Follow Up Blog on the Consciousness Fight
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charset=utf-8
Just wanted to shout out to Gregg, Rick and crew. This has been a fun =
thread. I hope in the future to participate more. Thanks for doing =
this!!
Gregg- you got a real onion (smells good:) =E2=80=94 so many layers I =
continue to conceptually unpack!
I hope at some point to discuss a predictive processing informed =
experiential identity stack model that includes the thinking-justifying =
human person (private/public part-narratives), the level below of the =
perceiving-feeling-moving animal that wants to feel =
safe/secure/approaching, the level below as awareness itself (qualities =
of openness, freedom, peace/bliss/love), and the highest (yet- and =
doesn=E2=80=99t mean better but more complex) as a =
metacognitive-transjective self. The CALM-MO could initally serve as a =
function for therapy/self-exploration and later generate identity as =
metacognition is applied to world, self, other and =E2=80=9Csee=E2=80=9D =
transjectively all we epistemically know is through the medium of =
consciousness. Through practice, one can deconstruct the self-world =
models to awareness and its constructive contents. We can rebuild the =
stacks too. Metacognitively one could recognize that consciousness is =
emerging through/from the living nervous system but even the thinking of =
this is a model=E2=80=94 models nested in models, even raw experience. =
And with the deep continuity of TOK, that living organism is a strong =
emergent feature of the entire cosmos=E2=80=94 wave in the ocean =
metaphorically. Perhaps a multirecursive self that loops awareness on =
itself, perceving/feeling/moveing on itself, thinking/narrative/modeling =
on itself, and metcognitively-transjectively looping on itself that =
adjusts based on relevance.=20
Practices are critical to integrate within level, different levels =
above/below and integrating across levels.=20
Rick- I totally support openness/flexibility of the pure metaphysics in =
folks you noted- Kastrup, Hoffman, Tononi etc- Over time I=E2=80=99ve =
worn these ontologies like garments and interesting how they shift the =
view about life and reality. At times left me confused, other times =
opened my views. I particularly have enjoyed the work by Gregg and John =
on transcendental naturalism as an advance but open take. I like the =
view of a stratified reality (Platonic, Bhaskar). In my opinion, most of =
the time, many of us (or at least me) live in a default, fitness reality =
of subjects and objects in a static world. Through examination, =
scientific and phenomenological, etc we enter a relatively reality that =
can include descriptive metaphysics externally as TOK and =
internal-epistemically as the stratified-layered self composed of loops =
of awareness, perceptions-feelings, thought-justification, and =
metacognitive justifications open to ongoing change. Fitness and =
relative reality emerge from an absolute reality that implicitly carries =
and emanates the stack of energy-information, matter, life, mind, =
culture-person, technium/holos(fill in a word). This absolute reality =
should not be defined by a layer of the stack, nor are we are aware of =
what else may emanate. But absolute reality emanates. Completely =
naturalistic and open to how broad natural may be/become.=20
My day work involves modulating brains with magnetic-electric methods to =
reduce suffering and I look forward to UTOK elements becoming more =
mainstream in psychiatry.
Will work on unpacking more of this after reading more on I-Coin.=20
All the best,
Baron
Baron Short, MD, MSCR
Associate Professor of Psychiatry and Medicine
Medical Director, Brain Stimulation Service=20
Medical University of South Carolina
Institute of Psychiatry
#67 President Street, MSC 861
Charleston, SC 29425
https://muschealth.org/medical-services/psychiatry/brain-stimulation
Podcast - =
https://advance.muschealth.org/library/2022/may/brain-stimulation-for-depr=
ession-podcast
> On Oct 10, 2023, at 6:44=E2=80=AFAM, Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx =
<[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>=20
> CAUTION: External
>=20
> Rick,
> =20
> We are in agreement. If we look closely at the ToK System, we see it =
represents both ontological continuity and discontinuity. That is, Life =
is continuous with the Matter dimension, and at the same time, =
discontinuous with it, depending on what is being emphasized. So, if we =
come from the bottom and look to see continuity, we will find it. =
Conversely, if we come from the top, we will see discontinuity.
> <image001.png>
> As I note in my book A New Synthesis, a virus would be placed in the =
grey-green area between Matter and Life and it exhibits many properties =
of living organisms, but not all.
> =20
> The primary property of mindedness ABOVE Life is the multicellar =
sensory-motor loop, the domain of Mind1. I agree it is functionally =
continuous with Life in many ways. However, the Cambrian explosion =
happens because you get animals with brains and complex active bodies =
that =E2=80=9Cjump=E2=80=9D into a new adaptive design space=E2=80=A6i.e.,=
they can move around and eat each other in what we experience as =
=E2=80=9Cnormal sized=E2=80=9D space. And that is the core of =
Mindedness, the cybernetic regulation of the behavioral investment =
activities. That design space, with the machinery of the brain and =
complex active bodies and predator-prey relations then opened up a new =
set of =E2=80=9Cadjacent possibles=E2=80=9D to use Kauffman=E2=80=99s =
term. And that became a qualitative difference.
> =20
> Best,
> G=20
> =20
> From: UTOK Society listserv <[log in to unmask] =
<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> On Behalf Of Rick Repetti
> Sent: Monday, October 9, 2023 8:23 PM
> To: [log in to unmask] =
<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: Re: Follow Up Blog on the Consciousness Fight
> =20
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links =
or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content =
is safe.
> =20
> Excellent response! Thank you! I suppose my intuition favors =
considering the flexibly teleological sensorimotor ability of the =
paramecium as a function of a kind of relational *awareness* of the =
organism/environment dynamic and thus as the most rudimentary element of =
mindedness, akin to the frog and the lovers but more primitive. The =
difference between this and mind1a or mind1b seems to be more a =
pragmatic matter of taxonomic semantic preference than an essential =
ontological difference.=20
> =20
> Your system parses mind and non-mind according to the presence or =
absence of neurons, respectively, which makes your system a neurocentric =
model, as opposed to Reber=E2=80=99s biocentric model, but all organisms =
are teleological, whereas viruses are not organisms, but they appear to =
be teleological. I think there is a parallel here: from the perspective =
of your model, organisms lacking neurons are to mind what non-organism =
but teleological entities are to life.=20
> =20
> =F0=9F=98=89
>=20
> Best regards,=20
> =20
> Rick Repetti=20
>=20
>=20
> On Oct 9, 2023, at 12:11 PM, Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx =
<[log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
>=20
> =EF=BB=BF=20
> Great questions, Rick.
> =20
> For me, we want to elucidate the pattern that we are referencing and =
see what characteristics it has. My terms =E2=80=9Cfunctional awareness =
and responsivity=E2=80=9D suggest that the entity in question is =
tracking an informational aspect of its environment and responding =
toward some end state. Here is William James describing functional =
awareness and responsivity in frogs and in Romeo, and contrasting them =
with bubbles and iron shavings attracted by a magnet:
> =20
> Unlike the bubbles, a frog will not perpetually press his nose against =
[the jar=E2=80=99s] unyielding
> roof, but will restlessly explore the neighborhood until by =
re-descending again he has discovered
> a path around its brim to the goal of his desires. The case is the =
same for Romeo
> and Juliet: Romeo wants Juliet as the filings want the magnet; and if =
no obstacles intervene
> he moves toward her by as a straight as line as they. But Romeo and =
Juliet, if a wall be built
> between them, do not remain idiotically pressing their faces against =
its opposite sides like
> the magnet and the fillings with the card. Romeo soon finds a =
circuitous way, by scaling
> the wall or otherwise, of touching Juliet=E2=80=99s lips directly. =
With the fillings, the path is fixed;
> whether it reaches the end depends on accidents. With the lover it is =
the end which is fixed,
> the path may be modified indefinitely.
> =20
> Regarding your point about awareness sounding like is aligns with =
mind, I agree that it does. My basic retort is that the Enlightenment =
Gap left us with a poor vocabulary and grip on mind. It has many =
different elements. If you emphasize/define mind purely via a =
cognitive/epistemic/knowing/awareness functional aspect, then, yep, you =
will see mind in a paramecium, and I would say we are starting to see it =
in artificial intelligence. For me, I just want to call that =
intelligence or cognition, broadly defined as =E2=80=9Cfunctional =
information processing toward end states via some kind of cybernetic =
regulation.=E2=80=9D The ToK System suggests we can have a more specific =
definition of mind, specifically, when these processes are mediated by =
the nervous system and take place in animals. I fully acknowledge that =
this is a matter of =E2=80=9Clanguage games=E2=80=9D in that definitions =
live in contexts and function in systems of justification and we should =
be very suspicious of anyone trying to insist on a priori definitions. I =
am couching my claims in a specific set of problems and trying to =
justify why I think this definitional system works in this context.
>=20
> Best,
> G
> =20
> =20
> =20
> =20
> =20
> From: UTOK Society listserv <[log in to unmask] =
<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> On Behalf Of Rick Repetti
> Sent: Monday, October 9, 2023 11:10 AM
> To: [log in to unmask] =
<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: Re: Follow Up Blog on the Consciousness Fight
> =20
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links =
or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content =
is safe.
> =20
> Gregg,=20
> =20
> Ok, thanks for the clarification! What remains for me is curiosity =
about the difference between your use of the notion of organisms=E2=80=99 =
environmental =E2=80=98awareness=E2=80=99 and responsiveness as not =
minded. This may be a semantics issue. In Arthur Reber=E2=80=99s =
Caterpillars, Karyotes, and Consciousness, however, he seems to consider =
both minded (if memory serves, but I read his book before it came out, =
as a reviewer, and that was some years ago, so memory fades).=20
> =20
> The use of the term =E2=80=98awareness=E2=80=99 suggests mindedness to =
me. What differentiates a paramecium=E2=80=99s attraction to nutrients =
and aversion to toxins from the behavior of the two poles of a magnet =
next to another magnet? Would we say that when the magnets move they are =
aware of, and responding to magnetism, or when metal rusts it is aware =
of environmental oxygen and responding to it?=20
> =20
> Again, I genuinely mean these questions in the spirit of better =
understanding, as I am writing a chapter on awareness right now, for an =
edited collection on the philosophy of transformation. I don=E2=80=99t =
want to say anything silly, and if I=E2=80=99m not clear about where =
mindedness begins and ends, I need to be much more tentative in my =
claims. =20
>=20
> I greatly appreciate your responsiveness to all of these emails. Where =
do you get the time, Gregg?
> =20
> Best regards,=20
> =20
> Rick Repetti=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> On Oct 8, 2023, at 11:19 AM, Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx =
<[log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
>=20
> =EF=BB=BF=20
> Hi Rick,
> =20
> Thanks for the question.
> =20
> Mind1 is defined as the functional awareness and responsivity of =
animals with a nervous system (actually, the exemplar I like of Mind1 =
extends this definition into a brain and a complex active body=E2=80=94I =
can explain why if you want). The basic issue is that we need to =
differentiate =E2=80=9Cfunctional awareness and responsivity=E2=80=9D as =
one criteria and separate it out from the medium of information =
processing. For me, I would use words like intelligence or the broad =
definition of =E2=80=9Ccognition=E2=80=9D. As I note in this series on =
consciousness, it also can sometimes be what people mean by =
consciousness, but you need to be careful.
> =20
> Anyway, the point is that Mind1 has the functional awareness and =
responsivity, but it also has the =E2=80=9Cmediated by the nervous =
system=E2=80=9D. Life, or bio-intelligence is functional awareness and =
responsivity that is mediated by cellular activity.
> =20
> So a paramecium moving in that way is exhibiting bio-cognitive =
activity or living intelligence. However, it is not actually Mind1 =
because Mind1 requires a nervous system. Rather a paramecium moving away =
from toxins is exhibiting functional awareness and responsivity is an =
example of living intelligence or bio-cognition or words to that effect.
> =20
> A housefly avoiding a flyswatter is Mind1, and is an example of overt =
neurocognitive activity or overt mental or minded behavior.
> =20
> A drone or robot=E2=80=99s responsiveness is artificial or =
technological intelligence.
> =20
> So, intelligence or cognition is the referent for the functional =
awareness and responsivity. Life connects that to cells/organisms, =
whereas Mind connects that to nervous systems and animals.
> =20
> Welcome comments or reactions as always.
> =20
> Warmly,
> G=20
> =20
> =20
> =20
> =20
> =20
> From: UTOK Society listserv <[log in to unmask] =
<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> On Behalf Of Rick Repetti
> Sent: Sunday, October 8, 2023 10:59 AM
> To: [log in to unmask] =
<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: Re: Follow Up Blog on the Consciousness Fight
> =20
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links =
or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content =
is safe.
> =20
> Gregg,=20
> =20
> As you know, I am sympathetic to your view here, but I find it =
difficult to differentiate between a paramecium that is chemically =
attracted to nutrients and chemically repelled by toxins, on the one =
hand, which behavioral responsiveness to environmental factors UTOK =
identifies as mind1, and a robot=E2=80=99s responsiveness, on the other =
hand. I do not intend this as an objection, but rather as a request for =
the differentiating principle. I tend to have a bias in favor of a =
biocentric view of mind, but that is not itself an argument. can you =
please remind me of your argument for this? I=E2=80=99m sure you have =
one. Thanks!
> =20
> Best regards,=20
> =20
> Rick Repetti=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> On Oct 8, 2023, at 10:32 AM, michael kazanjian =
<[log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
>=20
> =EF=BB=BF=20
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links =
or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content =
is safe.
> =20
> Johnny :
> =20
> Your response to Gregg motivates to add to Searle's "Chinese Room." I =
see a number of examples show a flaw in pure empricism:
> Police undercover
> WWII Operation Deception
> Our dropping bogus Army in Calaise during Normandy invasion
> camouflage
> seeing mirages
> Churchill on Coventry Bombing
> Each is a case where we "see" something, but that something is not =
"real." Something is always more than sense experience.
> =20
> Best,
> =20
> M M Kazanjian
> =20
> =20
> On Sunday, October 8, 2023 at 09:16:47 AM CDT, Johnny Lau =
<[log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
> =20
> =20
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links =
or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content =
is safe.
> =20
> Congrats on the articles, Gregg!
> =20
> I wonder if the popularity is from professional practitioners that are =
looking for answers or at least intimations of a basic, paradigmatic =
correction.
> =20
> Thanks for the clarification in terms of UTOK. I see that your leveled =
ontology is strongly hierarchical in that a minded being must be a live =
being.
> =20
> So if its fair to say that anything that appears mindlike but is not =
alive, like a drone or chat gpt, falls out of the TOK ontology, what do =
we make of our phenomenological relation to these "beings"? To me, at =
stake here is that part of ethics which overlaps phenomenology. I see it =
as the anthropological tendency that gives rise to primitive animism and =
contemporary panpsychism (which is an undercurrent I see in IIT, quantum =
cosmomogists, and whiteheadians). Perhaps this is a confused =
overextension of ontology to account for an ethical intuition. I wonder =
if resistance to ontological clarity is against the critic of =
"anthropocentrism" dispensing with those ethical intuitions (and perhaps =
its quite unconscious).
> =20
> Let me see if I can illustrate my understanding of "contemporary =
panpsychic ethics" more concretely. I studied computer science so this =
is why I'm focused on Turing test and subsequent thought experiments. So =
what's the stance on the "Chinese Room" nowadays? IIRC, John Searle =
posed it as an ad absurdum, but personally I think the "systems =
interpretation" should really win out here, where there is some =
"framing" of the phenomenona that is "understanding chinese." That's the =
language that I see forming around Chat GPT as "not a minded agent =
itself" but part of a "distributed cognitive system" that's something =
like an organ of a larger ecology.=20
> =20
> Now to make the ethical more apparent, consider Jordan Peterson's Room =
experiment: where are the bounds of Jordan's body and being when =
cleaning his room is part of that system of health?
> =20
> What I'm hoping to roughly sketch is an identity between the "academic =
panpsychic" and the "ecological ethicist," where the ambiguous mindlike =
objects in question are on one end the extended bounds of an individual, =
and on the other end the ecological, distributed, and hyperobject =
beings. After all, while we're on one hand "anthropocentrically =
projecting", we are also inclined to hold accountable corporations, =
nations, perhaps "Molochian" phenomena as moral agents themselves.
> =20
> Best,
> Johnny
> =20
> =20
> =20
>=20
> On Sun, Oct 8, 2023, 8:55 AM Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx =
<[log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
> Thanks, Johnny.
>=20
> =20
>=20
> The language issues here are important to wrestle with.
>=20
> =20
>=20
> Part of the issue that you may be picking up on here is that UTOK is =
trying to shift our vocabulary around the concept of Mind. Mind should =
be defined first in terms of mindedness, a property of the third =
dimension of complexification. Everything that is minded is also alive. =
Thus, if it is not alive, it also can=E2=80=99t have a mind. This is the =
basic descriptive metaphysical grammar that UTOK ToK System emphasizes. =
When we combine it with the Enlightenment Gap, the argument is that our =
grammar regarding mind has been deeply confused. Drones are not =
=E2=80=9Cminded=E2=80=9D any more than they are alive. They exhibit =
artificial or technological intelligence.
>=20
> =20
>=20
> I think the reason we are now questioning the Turing Test is because =
we can now see that artificial intelligence can indeed mimic/parrot our =
propositional language without any kind of mindedness.=20
>=20
>=20
> Best,
> Gregg
>=20
> =20
>=20
> From: UTOK Society listserv <[log in to unmask] =
<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> On Behalf Of Johnny Lau
> Sent: Friday, October 6, 2023 11:07 AM
> To: [log in to unmask] =
<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: Re: Follow Up Blog on the Consciousness Fight
>=20
> =20
>=20
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links =
or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content =
is safe.
>=20
> =20
>=20
> Thanks all for the discourse!
>=20
> =20
>=20
> I want to make sure I don't come off disrespectful of the necessity =
for precise technical definition (which is the heart of the issue), =
where Greg's introduction of unoque terms of Mind_N are absolutely =
functionally appropriate.
>=20
> =20
>=20
> As a layperson speaking to other laypersons not always with recourse =
to their attention on articles, I think it's fair to further the =
discussion by asking "okay so what are the closest words we do have" in =
the spirit of Wittgenstein's family resemblances and such.
>=20
> =20
>=20
> As a seeker that surveys the literature but not with the technical =
systematic rigour of an academic, I quickly encounter all sorts of =
jingle jangles. So with the privilege of being in a diverse but highly =
academic circle here, I think it's super interesting and elucidating to =
draw out a map of the terrain to help translate or further discriminate =
what exactly people in cog Sci, vs psychology, vs existentialism, vs =
Buddhist philosophy emphasize and like carving up on the thing called =
"mind" or "soul."
>=20
> =20
>=20
> And I am noticing the different flavors of verticality so far: from =
zombie to person... and how quickly we're falling away from giving to =
much credit to being biologically human as we're liable to zombiness and =
not enough credit to drones since someday AI will or do express mind. =
After all, AI folks are quick to dissuade the public from eagerly =
humanizing chat gpt. Funny how the Turing test is so irrelevantly =
compelling in just a few decades it's slipped into the background of our =
collective consciousness.
>=20
> =20
>=20
> =20
>=20
> =20
>=20
> On Fri, Oct 6, 2023, 7:23 AM Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx =
<[log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
>=20
> Hi Johnny and Brandon,
>=20
> =20
>=20
> It is crucial that, first and foremost, the words have a clear, =
refined meaning. That is, the words need to be consensually agreed upon =
by the experts.=20
>=20
> =20
>=20
> One way to describe them might be: zombie animals, sentient animals, =
and self conscious animals.=20
>=20
> =20
>=20
> Obviously zombie is Mind1, sentient is Mind2, and self-conscious is =
Mind3.
>=20
> =20
>=20
> Best,
>=20
> Gregg
>=20
> =20
>=20
> Sent from my iPhone
>=20
> =20
>=20
> On Oct 6, 2023, at 2:00 AM, Brandon Norgaard =
<[log in to unmask] =
<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
>=20
> =EF=BB=BF
>=20
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links =
or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content =
is safe.
>=20
> =20
>=20
> I like the triad that Johnny has suggested. I have also heard Gregg =
say that beings that have mind3 capabilities are persons by definition =
and that he is leaving open the possibility that other species besides =
humans might have these abilities (extraterrestrial life or future =
evolution of certain animal species) because he defines the term person =
in structural-functional terms. If we are talking about a being that =
usesjustification systems and participates in Culture for livelihood, =
then we=E2=80=99re talking about a person. I know John V likes to talk =
about the agent/arena relationship so I agree that would be another =
possible term for beings that have mind3. I=E2=80=99m wondering if =
anyone has ideas for other possible terms for mind1/2/3?
>=20
> =20
>=20
> -Brandon
>=20
> =20
>=20
> From: UTOK Society listserv <[log in to unmask] =
<mailto:[log in to unmask]>> On Behalf Of Johnny Lau
> Sent: Thursday, October 5, 2023 11:03 AM
> To: [log in to unmask] =
<mailto:[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: Re: Follow Up Blog on the Consciousness Fight
>=20
> =20
>=20
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links =
or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content =
is safe.
>=20
> =20
>=20
> Can we entertain catchier terms for mind1/2/3?=20
>=20
> =20
>=20
> How about being, creature, and agent?
>=20
> =20
>=20
> On Wed, Oct 4, 2023, 1:58 PM Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx =
<[log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:
>=20
> Hi Folks,
>=20
> =20
>=20
> I put up a follow up blog on the fight in consciousness research:
>=20
> We Need a Better Vocabulary for Mind and Consciousness | Psychology =
Today =
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> =20
>=20
> Best,
> G
>=20
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--Apple-Mail=_45521181-C01B-4733-A90E-A79042C700BD
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/html;
charset=utf-8
<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"overflow-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;">Just wanted to =
shout out to Gregg, Rick and crew. This has been a fun thread. I hope in =
the future to participate more. Thanks for doing =
this!!<div><br></div><div>Gregg- you got a real onion (smells good:) =E2=80=
=94 so many layers I continue to conceptually unpack!</div><div>I hope =
at some point to discuss a predictive processing informed experiential =
identity stack model that includes the thinking-justifying human person =
(private/public part-narratives), the level below of the =
perceiving-feeling-moving animal that wants to feel =
safe/secure/approaching, the level below as awareness itself (qualities =
of openness, freedom, peace/bliss/love), and the highest (yet- and =
doesn=E2=80=99t mean better but more complex) as a =
metacognitive-transjective self. The CALM-MO could initally serve as a =
function for therapy/self-exploration and later generate identity as =
metacognition is applied to world, self, other and =E2=80=9Csee=E2=80=9D =
transjectively all we epistemically know is through the medium of =
consciousness. Through practice, one can deconstruct the self-world =
models to awareness and its constructive contents. We can rebuild the =
stacks too. Metacognitively one could recognize that consciousness is =
emerging through/from the living nervous system but even the thinking of =
this is a model=E2=80=94 models nested in models, even raw experience. =
And with the deep continuity of TOK, that living organism is a strong =
emergent feature of the entire cosmos=E2=80=94 wave in the ocean =
metaphorically. Perhaps a multirecursive self that loops awareness on =
itself, perceving/feeling/moveing on itself, thinking/narrative/modeling =
on itself, and metcognitively-transjectively looping on itself that =
adjusts based on relevance. </div><div>Practices are critical to =
integrate within level, different levels above/below and integrating =
across levels. </div><div><br></div><div>Rick- I totally support =
openness/flexibility of the pure metaphysics in folks you noted- =
Kastrup, Hoffman, Tononi etc- Over time I=E2=80=99ve worn these =
ontologies like garments and interesting how they shift the view about =
life and reality. At times left me confused, other times opened my =
views. I particularly have enjoyed the work by Gregg and John on =
transcendental naturalism as an advance but open take. I like the view =
of a stratified reality (Platonic, Bhaskar). In my opinion, most of the =
time, many of us (or at least me) live in a default, fitness reality of =
subjects and objects in a static world. Through examination, scientific =
and phenomenological, etc we enter a relatively reality that can include =
descriptive metaphysics externally as TOK and internal-epistemically as =
the stratified-layered self composed of loops of awareness, =
perceptions-feelings, thought-justification, and metacognitive =
justifications open to ongoing change. Fitness and relative reality =
emerge from an absolute reality that implicitly carries and emanates the =
stack of energy-information, matter, life, mind, culture-person, =
technium/holos(fill in a word). This absolute reality should not be =
defined by a layer of the stack, nor are we are aware of what else may =
emanate. But absolute reality emanates. Completely naturalistic and open =
to how broad natural may be/become. </div><div><br></div><div>My =
day work involves modulating brains with magnetic-electric methods to =
reduce suffering and I look forward to UTOK elements becoming more =
mainstream in psychiatry.</div><div><br></div><div>Will work on =
unpacking more of this after reading more on =
I-Coin. </div><div><br></div><div>All the =
best,</div><div><br></div><div>Baron</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><d=
iv><br id=3D"lineBreakAtBeginningOfMessage"><div>
<meta charset=3D"UTF-8"><div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"text-align: start; =
text-indent: 0px; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; =
line-break: after-white-space;"><div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"text-align: =
start; text-indent: 0px; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: =
space; line-break: after-white-space;"><div dir=3D"auto" =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: =
after-white-space;"><div style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: =
rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; word-spacing: 0px; text-decoration: none; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-align: start; text-indent: =
0px;">Baron Short, MD, MSCR<br>Associate Professor of Psychiatry =
and Medicine<br>Medical Director, Brain Stimulation =
Service <br>Medical University of South Carolina<br>Institute of =
Psychiatry<br>#67 President Street, MSC 861<br>Charleston, SC =
29425<br>https://muschealth.org/medical-services/psychiatry/brain-stimulat=
ion</div><div style=3D"text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;">Podcast =
- https://advance.muschealth.org/library/2022/may/brain-stimulation-f=
or-depression-podcast</div></div></div></div>
</div>
<div><br><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div>On Oct 10, 2023, at 6:44=E2=80=AFA=
M, Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx <[log in to unmask]> wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div><meta charset=3D"UTF-8"><b =
style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: =
18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; letter-spacing: =
normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; =
white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-decoration: none;"><p style=3D"color: rgb(238, 118, 0); font-size: =
13pt; text-align: center; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); =
text-decoration: underline;">CAUTION: External</p></b><span =
style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: =
18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; =
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; =
display: inline !important;"></span><div style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, =
0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; =
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-decoration: none;"><div class=3D"WordSection1" style=3D"page: =
WordSection1;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;">Rick,<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> We are in =
agreement. If we look closely at the ToK System, we see it represents =
both ontological continuity and discontinuity. That is, Life is =
continuous with the Matter dimension, and at the same time, =
discontinuous with it, depending on what is being emphasized. So, if we =
come from the bottom and look to see continuity, we will find it. =
Conversely, if we come from the top, we will see =
discontinuity.<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
id=3D"cid:image001.png@01D9FB44.537F2650"><image001.png></span><o:p>=
</o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"> As I note in my book A New Synthesis, =
a virus would be placed in the grey-green area between Matter and Life =
and it exhibits many properties of living organisms, but not =
all.<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> The primary property of mindedness ABOVE Life is the =
multicellar sensory-motor loop, the domain of Mind1. I agree it is =
functionally continuous with Life in many ways. However, the Cambrian =
explosion happens because you get animals with brains and complex active =
bodies that =E2=80=9Cjump=E2=80=9D into a new adaptive design =
space=E2=80=A6i.e., they can move around and eat each other in what we =
experience as =E2=80=9Cnormal sized=E2=80=9D space. And that is the core =
of Mindedness, the cybernetic regulation of the behavioral investment =
activities. That design space, with the machinery of the brain and =
complex active bodies and predator-prey relations then opened up a new =
set of =E2=80=9Cadjacent possibles=E2=80=9D to use Kauffman=E2=80=99s =
term. And that became a qualitative difference.<o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Best,<br>G<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></div><div><div style=3D"border-width: 1pt =
medium medium; border-style: solid none none; border-color: rgb(225, =
225, 225) currentcolor currentcolor; border-image: none; padding: 3pt =
0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><b>From:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>UTOK Society listserv =
<<a href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" style=3D"color: =
blue; text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a>><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Rick =
Repetti<br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>Monday, October 9, 2023 =
8:23 PM<br><b>To:</b><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><a=
href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" style=3D"color: blue; =
text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a><br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: Follow Up Blog on the =
Consciousness Fight<o:p></o:p></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></div><table class=3D"MsoNormalTable" =
border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" align=3D"left" =
width=3D"100%" style=3D"width: 1125px;"><tbody><tr><td =
style=3D"background: red; padding: 5.25pt 1.5pt;"></td><td width=3D"100%" =
style=3D"width: 1091px; background: rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt =
3.75pt 5.25pt 11.25pt;"><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><b><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; =
font-family: "Segoe UI", sans-serif; color: rgb(112, 48, =
160);">CAUTION:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Segoe UI", =
sans-serif;">This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click =
links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the =
content is safe.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: =
"Segoe UI", sans-serif; color: rgb(33, 33, =
33);"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></td><td width=3D"75" style=3D"width: =
56.25pt; background: rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt =
3.75pt;"></td></tr></tbody></table><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Excellent response! =
Thank you! I suppose my intuition favors considering the flexibly =
teleological sensorimotor ability of the paramecium as a function of a =
kind of relational *awareness* of the organism/environment dynamic and =
thus as the most rudimentary element of mindedness, akin to the frog and =
the lovers but more primitive. The difference between this and mind1a or =
mind1b seems to be more a pragmatic matter of taxonomic semantic =
preference than an essential ontological =
difference. <o:p></o:p></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Your system =
parses mind and non-mind according to the presence or absence of =
neurons, respectively, which makes your system a neurocentric model, as =
opposed to Reber=E2=80=99s biocentric model, but all organisms are =
teleological, whereas viruses are not organisms, but they appear to be =
teleological. I think there is a parallel here: from the perspective of =
your model, organisms lacking neurons are to mind what non-organism but =
teleological entities are to life. <o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></div></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-family: "Segoe UI Emoji", =
sans-serif;">=F0=9F=98=89</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Best =
regards,<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p> </o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Rick =
Repetti <o:p></o:p></div></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><br><br><o:p></o:p></div><blockquote style=3D"margin-top: =
5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;"><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">On Oct 9, =
2023, at 12:11 PM, Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx <<a =
href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" style=3D"color: blue; text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div><blockquote style=3D"margin-top: =
5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;"><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">=EF=BB=BF<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">Great questions, Rick.<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">For me, we want to =
elucidate the pattern that we are referencing and see what =
characteristics it has. My terms =E2=80=9Cfunctional awareness and =
responsivity=E2=80=9D suggest that the entity in question is tracking an =
informational aspect of its environment and responding toward some end =
state. Here is William James describing functional awareness and =
responsivity in frogs and in Romeo, and contrasting them with bubbles =
and iron shavings attracted by a magnet:<o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Unlike the bubbles, =
a frog will not perpetually press his nose against [the jar=E2=80=99s] =
unyielding<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">roof, but will restlessly explore the =
neighborhood until by re-descending again he has =
discovered<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">a path around its brim to the goal of =
his desires. The case is the same for Romeo<o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">and Juliet: Romeo wants Juliet as the filings want the =
magnet; and if no obstacles intervene<o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">he moves toward her by as a straight as line as they. But =
Romeo and Juliet, if a wall be built<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin:=
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">between them, =
do not remain idiotically pressing their faces against its opposite =
sides like<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">the magnet and the fillings with the =
card. Romeo soon finds a circuitous way, by scaling<o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">the wall or otherwise, of touching Juliet=E2=80=99s lips =
directly. With the fillings, the path is fixed;<o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">whether it reaches the end depends on accidents. With the =
lover it is the end which is fixed,<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">the path may be =
modified indefinitely.<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Regarding your point =
about awareness sounding like is aligns with mind, I agree that it does. =
My basic retort is that the Enlightenment Gap left us with a poor =
vocabulary and grip on mind. It has many different elements. If you =
emphasize/define mind purely via a cognitive/epistemic/knowing/awareness =
functional aspect, then, yep, you will see mind in a paramecium, and I =
would say we are starting to see it in artificial intelligence. For me, =
I just want to call that intelligence or cognition, broadly defined as =
=E2=80=9Cfunctional information processing toward end states via some =
kind of cybernetic regulation.=E2=80=9D The ToK System suggests we can =
have a more specific definition of mind, specifically, when these =
processes are mediated by the nervous system and take place in animals. =
I fully acknowledge that this is a matter of =E2=80=9Clanguage games=E2=80=
=9D in that definitions live in contexts and function in systems of =
justification and we should be very suspicious of anyone trying to =
insist on a priori definitions. I am couching my claims in a specific =
set of problems and trying to justify why I think this definitional =
system works in this context.<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><br>Best,<br>G<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div><div style=3D"border-width: 1pt =
medium medium; border-style: solid none none; border-color: rgb(225, =
225, 225) currentcolor currentcolor; border-image: none; padding: 3pt =
0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><b>From:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>UTOK Society listserv =
<<a href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" style=3D"color: =
blue; text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a>><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Rick =
Repetti<br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>Monday, October 9, 2023 =
11:10 AM<br><b>To:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><a =
href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" style=3D"color: blue; =
text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a><br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: Follow Up Blog on the =
Consciousness Fight<o:p></o:p></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><table class=3D"MsoNormalTable" =
border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" align=3D"left" =
width=3D"100%" style=3D"width: 1045px;"><tbody><tr><td =
style=3D"background: red; padding: 5.25pt 1.5pt;"></td><td width=3D"100%" =
style=3D"width: 1011px; background: rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt =
3.75pt 5.25pt 11.25pt;"><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><b><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; =
font-family: "Segoe UI", sans-serif; color: rgb(112, 48, =
160);">CAUTION:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Segoe UI", =
sans-serif;">This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click =
links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the =
content is safe.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: =
"Segoe UI", sans-serif; color: rgb(33, 33, =
33);"></span><o:p></o:p></div></div></td><td width=3D"75" style=3D"width: =
56.25pt; background: rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt =
3.75pt;"></td></tr></tbody></table><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Gregg,<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Ok, thanks for =
the clarification! What remains for me is curiosity about the difference =
between your use of the notion of organisms=E2=80=99 environmental =
=E2=80=98awareness=E2=80=99 and responsiveness as not minded. This may =
be a semantics issue. In Arthur Reber=E2=80=99s Caterpillars, Karyotes, =
and Consciousness, however, he seems to consider both minded (if memory =
serves, but I read his book before it came out, as a reviewer, and that =
was some years ago, so memory =
fades). <o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">The use of the =
term =E2=80=98awareness=E2=80=99 suggests mindedness to me. What =
differentiates a paramecium=E2=80=99s attraction to nutrients and =
aversion to toxins from the behavior of the two poles of a magnet next =
to another magnet? Would we say that when the magnets move they are =
aware of, and responding to magnetism, or when metal rusts it is aware =
of environmental oxygen and responding to =
it? <o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Again, I =
genuinely mean these questions in the spirit of better understanding, as =
I am writing a chapter on awareness right now, for an edited collection =
on the philosophy of transformation. I don=E2=80=99t want to say =
anything silly, and if I=E2=80=99m not clear about where mindedness =
begins and ends, I need to be much more tentative in my claims. =
<br><br>I greatly appreciate your responsiveness to all of these =
emails. Where do you get the time, =
Gregg?<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Best regards,<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Rick =
Repetti <o:p></o:p></div></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></div><blockquote style=3D"margin-top:=
5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;"><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">On Oct 8, =
2023, at 11:19 AM, Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx <<a =
href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" style=3D"color: blue; text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div><blockquote style=3D"margin-top: =
5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;"><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">=EF=BB=BF<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">Hi Rick,<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> Thanks for =
the question.<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> Mind1 is defined as the functional awareness and =
responsivity of<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><i>animals with a nervous =
system</i><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>(actually, =
the exemplar I like of Mind1 extends this definition into a brain and a =
complex active body=E2=80=94I can explain why if you want). The basic =
issue is that we need to differentiate =E2=80=9Cfunctional awareness and =
responsivity=E2=80=9D as one criteria and separate it out from the =
medium of information processing. For me, I would use words like =
intelligence or the broad definition of =E2=80=9Ccognition=E2=80=9D. As =
I note in this series on consciousness, it also can sometimes be what =
people mean by consciousness, but you need to be =
careful.<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> Anyway, the point is that Mind1 has the functional =
awareness and responsivity, but it also has the =E2=80=9Cmediated by the =
nervous system=E2=80=9D. Life, or bio-intelligence is functional =
awareness and responsivity that is mediated by cellular =
activity.<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">So a paramecium moving in that way is exhibiting =
bio-cognitive activity or living intelligence. However, it is not =
actually Mind1 because Mind1 requires a nervous system. Rather a =
paramecium moving away from toxins is exhibiting functional awareness =
and responsivity is an example of living intelligence or bio-cognition =
or words to that effect.<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">A housefly avoiding =
a flyswatter is Mind1, and is an example of overt neurocognitive =
activity or overt mental or minded behavior.<o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">A drone or robot=E2=80=
=99s responsiveness is artificial or technological =
intelligence.<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">So, intelligence or cognition is the referent for the =
functional awareness and responsivity. Life connects that to =
cells/organisms, whereas Mind connects that to nervous systems and =
animals.<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">Welcome comments or reactions as =
always.<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">Warmly,<o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">G<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"> <span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div><div style=3D"border-width: 1pt =
medium medium; border-style: solid none none; border-color: rgb(225, =
225, 225) currentcolor currentcolor; border-image: none; padding: 3pt =
0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><b>From:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>UTOK Society listserv =
<<a href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" style=3D"color: =
blue; text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a>><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Rick =
Repetti<br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>Sunday, October 8, 2023 =
10:59 AM<br><b>To:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><a =
href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" style=3D"color: blue; =
text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a><br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: Follow Up Blog on the =
Consciousness Fight<o:p></o:p></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><table class=3D"MsoNormalTable" =
border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" align=3D"left" =
width=3D"100%" style=3D"width: 965px;"><tbody><tr><td style=3D"background:=
red; padding: 5.25pt 1.5pt;"></td><td width=3D"100%" style=3D"width: =
931px; background: rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt 3.75pt 5.25pt =
11.25pt;"><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><b><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: =
"Segoe UI", sans-serif; color: rgb(112, 48, =
160);">CAUTION:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Segoe UI", =
sans-serif;">This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click =
links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the =
content is safe.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: =
"Segoe UI", sans-serif; color: rgb(33, 33, =
33);"></span><o:p></o:p></div></div></td><td width=3D"75" style=3D"width: =
56.25pt; background: rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt =
3.75pt;"></td></tr></tbody></table><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Gregg,<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">As you know, I =
am sympathetic to your view here, but I find it difficult to =
differentiate between a paramecium that is chemically attracted to =
nutrients and chemically repelled by toxins, on the one hand, which =
behavioral responsiveness to environmental factors UTOK identifies as =
mind1, and a robot=E2=80=99s responsiveness, on the other hand. I do not =
intend this as an objection, but rather as a request for the =
differentiating principle. I tend to have a bias in favor of a =
biocentric view of mind, but that is not itself an argument. can you =
please remind me of your argument for this? I=E2=80=99m sure you have =
one. Thanks!<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Best regards,<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">Rick =
Repetti <o:p></o:p></div></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><br><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></div><blockquote =
style=3D"margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;"><p class=3D"MsoNormal" =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">On Oct 8, 2023, at 10:32 AM, michael kazanjian <<a =
href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" style=3D"color: blue; =
text-decoration: underline;">[log in to unmask]</a>> =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div><blockquote style=3D"margin-top: =
5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;"><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">=EF=BB=BF<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p></o:p></div><table =
class=3D"MsoNormalTable" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" =
align=3D"left" width=3D"100%" style=3D"width: 885px; display: table; =
float: none;"><tbody><tr><td style=3D"background: red; padding: 5.25pt =
1.5pt;"></td><td width=3D"100%" style=3D"width: 851px; background: =
rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt 3.75pt 5.25pt 11.25pt;"><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><b><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Segoe =
UI", sans-serif; color: rgb(112, 48, 160);">CAUTION:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Segoe UI", =
sans-serif;">This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click =
links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the =
content is safe.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: =
"Segoe UI", sans-serif; color: rgb(33, 33, =
33);"></span><o:p></o:p></div></div></td><td width=3D"75" style=3D"width: =
56.25pt; background: rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt =
3.75pt;"></td></tr></tbody></table><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"> <o:p></o:p></div><div><div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif;">Johnny =
:</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;">Your response to Gregg motivates to add to Searle's =
"Chinese Room." I see a number of examples show a flaw in pure =
empricism:</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;"> Police =
undercover</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;"> WWII =
Operation Deception</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;"> Our dropping =
bogus Army in Calaise during Normandy =
invasion</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;"> =
camouflage</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;"> seeing =
mirages</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;"> Churchill on =
Coventry Bombing</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif;">Each is a =
case where we "see" something, but that something is not =
"real." Something is always more than sense =
experience.</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;">Best,</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin:=
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;">M M Kazanjian</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div></div><div =
id=3D"yahoo_quoted_6922895592"><div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);">On Sunday, October 8, 2023 at 09:16:47 AM CDT, Johnny =
Lau <<a href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" style=3D"color: blue; =
text-decoration: underline;">[log in to unmask]</a>> =
wrote:</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
id=3D"yiv6316072303"><div><table class=3D"MsoNormalTable" border=3D"0" =
cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" align=3D"left" width=3D"100%" =
style=3D"width: 885px;"><tbody><tr><td style=3D"background: red; =
padding: 5.25pt 1.5pt;"></td><td width=3D"100%" style=3D"width: 851px; =
background: rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt 3.75pt 5.25pt =
11.25pt;"><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><b><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: =
"Segoe UI", sans-serif; color: rgb(112, 48, =
160);">CAUTION:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: "Segoe UI", =
sans-serif;">This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click =
links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the =
content is safe.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: =
"Segoe UI", sans-serif; color: rgb(33, 33, =
33);"></span><o:p></o:p></div></div></td><td width=3D"75" style=3D"width: =
56.25pt; background: rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt =
3.75pt;"></td></tr></tbody></table><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></div><div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);">Congrats on the articles, =
Gregg!</span><o:p></o:p></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);">I wonder if the popularity is from professional =
practitioners that are looking for answers or at least intimations of a =
basic, paradigmatic correction.</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);">Thanks for the clarification in terms of UTOK. I see =
that your leveled ontology is strongly hierarchical in that a minded =
being must be a live being.</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);">So if its fair to say that anything that appears =
mindlike but is not alive, like a drone or chat gpt, falls out of the =
TOK ontology, what do we make of our phenomenological relation to =
these "beings"? To me, at stake here is that part of ethics which =
overlaps phenomenology. I see it as the anthropological tendency that =
gives rise to primitive animism and contemporary panpsychism (which is =
an undercurrent I see in IIT, quantum cosmomogists, and whiteheadians). =
Perhaps this is a confused overextension of ontology to account for an =
ethical intuition. I wonder if resistance to ontological clarity is =
against the critic of "anthropocentrism" dispensing with those ethical =
intuitions (and perhaps its quite =
unconscious).</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">Let me see if I can illustrate my =
understanding of "contemporary panpsychic ethics" more concretely. I =
studied computer science so this is why I'm focused on Turing test and =
subsequent thought experiments. So what's the stance on the "Chinese =
Room" nowadays? IIRC, John Searle posed it as an ad absurdum, but =
personally I think the "systems interpretation" should really win out =
here, where there is some "framing" of the phenomenona that is =
"understanding chinese." That's the language that I see forming around =
Chat GPT as "not a minded agent itself" but part of a "distributed =
cognitive system" that's something like an organ of a larger =
ecology. </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">Now to make the ethical more =
apparent, consider Jordan Peterson's Room experiment: where are the =
bounds of Jordan's body and being when cleaning his room is part of that =
system of health?</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">What I'm hoping to roughly sketch =
is an identity between the "academic panpsychic" and the "ecological =
ethicist," where the ambiguous mindlike objects in question are on one =
end the extended bounds of an individual, and on the other end the =
ecological, distributed, and hyperobject beings. After all, while we're =
on one hand "anthropocentrically projecting", we are also inclined to =
hold accountable corporations, nations, perhaps "Molochian" phenomena as =
moral agents themselves.</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);">Best,</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);">Johnny</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></div></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div =
id=3D"yiv6316072303yqt49075"><div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);">On Sun, Oct 8, 2023, 8:55 AM Henriques, Gregg - =
henriqgx <<a href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" target=3D"_blank" =
style=3D"color: blue; text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a>> =
wrote:</span><o:p></o:p></div></div><blockquote style=3D"border-width: =
medium medium medium 1pt; border-style: none none none solid; =
border-color: currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rgb(204, 204, 204); =
border-image: none; padding: 0in 0in 0in 6pt; margin: 5pt 0in 5pt =
4.8pt;"><div><div><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">Thanks, =
Johnny.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">The =
language issues here are important to wrestle =
with.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">Part of the =
issue that you may be picking up on here is that UTOK is trying to shift =
our vocabulary around the concept of Mind. Mind should be defined first =
in terms of mindedness, a property of the third dimension of =
complexification. Everything that is minded is also alive. Thus, if it =
is not alive, it also can=E2=80=99t have a mind. This is the basic =
descriptive metaphysical grammar that UTOK ToK System emphasizes. When =
we combine it with the Enlightenment Gap, the argument is that our =
grammar regarding mind has been deeply confused. Drones are not =
=E2=80=9Cminded=E2=80=9D any more than they are alive. They exhibit =
artificial or technological intelligence.</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">I think the reason we are now =
questioning the Turing Test is because we can now see that artificial =
intelligence can indeed mimic/parrot our propositional language without =
any kind of mindedness.<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"><br>Best,<br>Gregg</span><o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div style=3D"border-width: 1pt =
medium medium; border-style: solid none none; border-color: rgb(225, =
225, 225) currentcolor currentcolor; border-image: none; padding: 3pt =
0in 0in;"><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: =
0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">From:</span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);"><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>UTOK =
Society listserv <<a href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" =
target=3D"_blank" style=3D"color: blue; text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a>><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Johnny =
Lau<br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>Friday, October 6, 2023 =
11:07 AM<br><b>To:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><a =
href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" target=3D"_blank" =
style=3D"color: blue; text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a><br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: Follow Up Blog on the =
Consciousness Fight</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><table =
class=3D"MsoNormalTable" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" =
align=3D"left" width=3D"100%" style=3D"width: =
869.609375px;"><tbody><tr><td style=3D"background: red; padding: 5.25pt =
1.5pt;"></td><td width=3D"100%" style=3D"width: 835.609375px; =
background: rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt 3.75pt 5.25pt =
11.25pt;"><div><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: =
0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><b><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: Arial, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(112, 48, 160);">CAUTION:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif;">This email =
originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links or open attachments =
unless you recognize the sender and know the content is =
safe.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: Arial, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(33, 33, =
33);"></span><o:p></o:p></p></div></td><td width=3D"75" style=3D"width: =
56.25pt; background: rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt =
3.75pt;"></td></tr></tbody></table><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">Thanks all for the =
discourse!</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">I want to make sure I don't come =
off disrespectful of the necessity for precise technical definition =
(which is the heart of the issue), where Greg's introduction of unoque =
terms of Mind_N are absolutely functionally =
appropriate.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">As a layperson speaking to other =
laypersons not always with recourse to their attention on articles, I =
think it's fair to further the discussion by asking "okay so what are =
the closest words we do have" in the spirit of Wittgenstein's family =
resemblances and such.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">As a seeker that surveys the =
literature but not with the technical systematic rigour of an academic, =
I quickly encounter all sorts of jingle jangles. So with the privilege =
of being in a diverse but highly academic circle here, I think it's =
super interesting and elucidating to draw out a map of the terrain to =
help translate or further discriminate what exactly people in cog Sci, =
vs psychology, vs existentialism, vs Buddhist philosophy emphasize and =
like carving up on the thing called "mind" or =
"soul."</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">And I am noticing the different =
flavors of verticality so far: from zombie to person... and how quickly =
we're falling away from giving to much credit to being biologically =
human as we're liable to zombiness and not enough credit to drones since =
someday AI will or do express mind. After all, AI folks are quick to =
dissuade the public from eagerly humanizing chat gpt. Funny how the =
Turing test is so irrelevantly compelling in just a few decades it's =
slipped into the background of our collective =
consciousness.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">On Fri, Oct 6, 2023, 7:23 AM =
Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx <<a href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" =
target=3D"_blank" style=3D"color: blue; text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a>> =
wrote:</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style=3D"border-width: =
medium medium medium 1pt; border-style: none none none solid; =
border-color: currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rgb(204, 204, 204); =
border-image: none; padding: 0in 0in 0in 6pt; margin: 5pt 0in 5pt =
4.8pt;"><div><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: =
0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">Hi Johnny and =
Brandon,</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">It is crucial that, first and =
foremost, the words have a clear, refined meaning. That is, the words =
need to be consensually agreed upon by the =
experts. </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">One way to describe them might be: =
zombie animals, sentient animals, and self conscious =
animals. </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">Obviously zombie is Mind1, sentient =
is Mind2, and self-conscious is =
Mind3.</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal"=
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);">Best,</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);">Gregg</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">Sent from my =
iPhone</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal"=
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><blockquote =
style=3D"margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;"><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; =
margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">On Oct 6, 2023, at 2:00 =
AM, Brandon Norgaard <<a =
href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" target=3D"_blank" =
style=3D"color: blue; text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a>> =
wrote:</span><o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div><blockquote =
style=3D"margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;"><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">=EF=BB=BF</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);"></span><o:p></o:p></p><table class=3D"MsoNormalTable" =
border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" align=3D"left" =
width=3D"100%" style=3D"width: 774.21875px; display: table; float: =
none;"><tbody><tr><td style=3D"background: red; padding: 5.25pt =
1.5pt;"></td><td width=3D"100%" style=3D"width: 740.21875px; background: =
rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt 3.75pt 5.25pt 11.25pt;"><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><b><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: Arial, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(112, 48, 160);">CAUTION:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif;">This email =
originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links or open attachments =
unless you recognize the sender and know the content is =
safe.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: Arial, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(33, 33, =
33);"></span><o:p></o:p></p></div></td><td width=3D"75" style=3D"width: =
56.25pt; background: rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt =
3.75pt;"></td></tr></tbody></table><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(34, 42, 53);">I like the triad that Johnny has =
suggested. I have also heard Gregg say that beings that have mind3 =
capabilities are<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><i>persons</i><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>by definition and that he =
is leaving open the possibility that other species besides humans might =
have these abilities (extraterrestrial life or future evolution of =
certain animal species) because he defines the term<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><i>person</i><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>in structural-functional =
terms. If we are talking about a being that uses<i>justification =
systems</i><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>and =
participates in<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><i>Culture</i><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>for livelihood, then =
we=E2=80=99re talking about a person. I know John V likes to talk =
about the agent/arena relationship so I agree that would be another =
possible term for beings that have mind3. I=E2=80=99m wondering if =
anyone has ideas for other possible terms for =
mind1/2/3?</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(34, 42, =
53);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal"=
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Arial, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 56, =
100);">-Brandon</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: Arial, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(34, 42, =
53);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div style=3D"border-width: 1pt =
medium medium; border-style: solid none none; border-color: rgb(225, =
225, 225) currentcolor currentcolor; border-image: none; padding: 3pt =
0in 0in;"><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: =
0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">From:</span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);"><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>UTOK =
Society listserv <<a href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" =
target=3D"_blank" style=3D"color: blue; text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a>><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Johnny =
Lau<br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>Thursday, October 5, 2023 =
11:03 AM<br><b>To:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span><a =
href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" target=3D"_blank" =
style=3D"color: blue; text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a><br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: Follow Up Blog on the =
Consciousness Fight</span><o:p></o:p></p></div></div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><table =
class=3D"MsoNormalTable" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0" =
align=3D"left" width=3D"100%" style=3D"width: =
774.21875px;"><tbody><tr><td style=3D"background: red; padding: 5.25pt =
1.5pt;"></td><td width=3D"100%" style=3D"width: 740.21875px; background: =
rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt 3.75pt 5.25pt 11.25pt;"><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><b><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: Arial, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(112, 48, 160);">CAUTION:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space"> </span></span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: Arial, sans-serif;">This email =
originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links or open attachments =
unless you recognize the sender and know the content is =
safe.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: Arial, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(33, 33, =
33);"></span><o:p></o:p></p></div></td><td width=3D"75" style=3D"width: =
56.25pt; background: rgb(255, 235, 156); padding: 5.25pt =
3.75pt;"></td></tr></tbody></table><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">Can we entertain catchier terms for =
mind1/2/3? </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">How about being, creature, and =
agent?</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(38, 40, 42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><div><div><p =
class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" style=3D"margin-right: 0in; =
margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">On Wed, Oct 4, 2023, 1:58 PM =
Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx <<a href=3D"mailto:[log in to unmask]" =
target=3D"_blank" style=3D"color: blue; text-decoration: =
underline;">[log in to unmask]</a>> =
wrote:</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style=3D"border-width: =
medium medium medium 1pt; border-style: none none none solid; =
border-color: currentcolor currentcolor currentcolor rgb(204, 204, 204); =
border-image: none; padding: 0in 0in 0in 6pt; margin: 5pt 0in 5pt =
4.8pt;"><div><div><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">Hi =
Folks,</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, =
42);"> </span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);">I put up a =
follow up blog on the fight in consciousness =
research:</span><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D"yiv6316072303msonormal" =
style=3D"margin-right: 0in; margin-left: 0in; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Helvetica, sans-serif; color: rgb(38, 40, 42);"><a =
href=3D"https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://nam10.safelinks.protection.out=
look.com/?url=3Dhttps*3A*2F*2Fwww.psychologytoday.com*2Fus*2Fblog*2Ftheory=
-of-knowledge*2F202310*2Fwe-need-a-better-vocabulary-for-mind-and-consciou=
sness&data=3D05*7C01*7CTOK-SOCIETY-L*40LISTSERV.JMU.EDU*7C5b26c7088562=
4008ca0108dbc97ddfb5*7Ce9333c23cac742f499895cee3d4a79c0*7C0*7C0*7C63832531=
4719775619*7CUnknown*7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJ=
BTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0*3D*7C3000*7C*7C*7C&sdata=3DySJOiHJvZRsq1UKshG=
RMOwkEL9ZFU3LxRUclPnIzTxU*3D&reserved=3D0__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJSUlJS=
UlJSUl!!Ab1_Rw!EiNiGofC23Hb6XwrkpBqW9QDvmJzeM4ABoZSPzeSw3ZuESER8FwKaVVgjMG=
qr_LO5sGhiKSK3xBIhSUpiQ$" =
originalsrc=3D"https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/theory-of-knowledge=
/202310/we-need-a-better-vocabulary-for-mind-and-consciousness" =
shash=3D"xqVt2SYhmdAG4EoAFnzinfOANfisgmEm4jtNf8PXD+9nFTsdYrFOW+66TKh2icq2w=
ZjwwOyhBvDNkz5PV3ZfRWW2iZfJyJc1yiZYRJbQ9FfH2i/i3ONO7oFZhaIzOAH5yNnj9AwiC5Q=
KxthPfc2FbJn2NxCrfVYPKGBP3U3fTyI=3D" target=3D"_blank" style=3D"color: =
blue; text-decoration: underline;">We Need a Better Vocabulary for Mind =
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