Lene, Nicholas, and Waldemar - thanks for your feedback and observations!

Gregg - good note to include the ToK planes on which these constructs
function.

Lee - I was really hoping you had some Wikiversity links to share...and you
did! Yay!

I think I've got it all included! I appreciate your engagement!

Warmly,

Ali

El jue, 13 ene 2022 a la(s) 11:10, Waldemar Schmidt ([log in to unmask])
escribió:

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> safe.
> ------------------------------
> Very interesting addition - by all (Ali, Lene, Nic, Gregg).
> Some observations, if I may:
>
>
>    - I tend to not agree that values are “trait based.”  Rather, they
>    seem to be trait influenced, among other influences.
>    - Let’s take a further step back: a consider “beliefs.”  I pose
>    (though, am not the author) that values are “beliefs which require action.”
>    - Hence, what do you all think precedes beliefs?
>
>
> All are constituents of “the human condition.”
>
> Best regards,
>
> Waldemar
>
>
>
> On Jan 13, 2022, at 7:22 AM, Nicholas Lattanzio <[log in to unmask]>
> wrote:
>
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> ------------------------------
> If anything is clear here it's that we have a similar type of levels of
> reality confusion. Many of these, like ethics and laws,  as Lee points out,
> are social constructs. Some, like values, and morals, actually do have
> biological representations (though not necessarily genesis). Someone
> correct me if I'm wrong, but virtues, while they may lend themselves to
> morality and ethics, are truly trait-based in nature (e.g., someone said to
> be kind in virtue is certainly high on the trait conscientiousness. When
> you add culture you add more than just culture, you add cultural ambiguity,
> which I see as a straightforward synonym for moral ambiguity, highlighting
> the link between the culture plane and the biological plane (affective) via
> the animal/mental plane. That complicates what is what in the sense that
> our values may be context dependent only in certain contexts that activate
> moral contingencies, thus creating positive feedback loops into reflective
> recursive awareness. I think this process expanded can explain a lot of
> where postmodernism fell into chaos.
>
> I have always struggled to find succinct ways to separate these
> definitions, though I can offer that I've never considered a principle to
> be one of these categories. I think a principle is a point that can be
> stood upon within ethics, morals, virtues, values, etc., and I suppose in
> that way is more a cross breed of a value-virtue enactment?
>
> Regards,
>
> Nicholas G. Lattanzio, Psy.D.
>
> On Thu, Jan 13, 2022, 6:30 AM lee simplyquality.org
> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__simplyquality.org&d=DwMFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=3JCnDsLJZGtIt8ZvEqUoAqGJ7KdTkE3kv6Cldo6dwJI&s=ocBdUzR6um26pDWlUlES9kekFxGi2zpBSklVbOAyfko&e=>
> <[log in to unmask]> wrote:
>
>> *CAUTION: *This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links
>> or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is
>> safe.
>> ------------------------------
>> Ali,
>> A great question and a great newsletter article!
>>
>> I wrote on the distinction between values and virtues at:
>> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikiversity.org_wiki_Virtues-23What-5Fis-5FVirtue-3F&d=DwIFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=bZ1rl10R_rXQpAqOnKEndTJxaibpyk6y-zOZWBNJDnM&s=FlMlTHwl1yg3K2O9kHdMZV5KS1BHNtL1gMpQelsvnLg&e= 
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikiversity.org_wiki_Virtues-23What-5Fis-5FVirtue-3F&d=DwMGaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=fzw3Y-sK2iE13BXCwH0Y9_NYjZ4Uv_1cfhuyRWKk4yg&s=8qiW3XpQankiT0XuBHF8Qk5s2NRfMPNNUNXrnRZjkSI&e=>
>> In short, a value is something we find important, and a virtue is the
>> consistent application of a value as our way of living.
>>
>> Values become virtues when they are internalized as enduring character
>> traits. For example, the value of "truth" becomes the virtue of "honesty"
>> when truth becomes a consistent motive for your behavior.
>>
>>
>> Morals help us decide “what should I do?” They are the “oughts” of our
>> lives.
>> See: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikiversity.org_wiki_Moral-5FReasoning&d=DwIFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=bZ1rl10R_rXQpAqOnKEndTJxaibpyk6y-zOZWBNJDnM&s=fpGR6kqIyhpPcxABTKfeDhdMbo--sdHaeQKHYOMhuSk&e= 
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikiversity.org_wiki_Moral-5FReasoning&d=DwMGaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=fzw3Y-sK2iE13BXCwH0Y9_NYjZ4Uv_1cfhuyRWKk4yg&s=6Vbz_gqTNOdPVBjD7Km8hLAgXrSftyuElul06c-ihxw&e=>
>>
>>
>> Many philosophers consider “ethics” and “morals” to be close synonyms.
>> Lene offers a useful distinction.
>> I like the Stanford encyclopedia of Philosophy as a reliable reference.
>> I notice they have an extensive article on the definition of morality,
>> but none of ethics.
>> See:  https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__plato.stanford.edu_entries_morality-2Ddefinition_&d=DwIFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=bZ1rl10R_rXQpAqOnKEndTJxaibpyk6y-zOZWBNJDnM&s=IIIlmbCBp8XZfMOWIACSMWXmLJ7BAo3ngHiNc4dRAc8&e= 
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__plato.stanford.edu_entries_morality-2Ddefinition_&d=DwMGaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=fzw3Y-sK2iE13BXCwH0Y9_NYjZ4Uv_1cfhuyRWKk4yg&s=mHk6UhH96_VTX_DIucRWIDLT3KnVmorJLyMcZ_FOeKc&e=>
>>
>> We need to be clear that (government) laws are social constructs.
>> See: Exploring Social Constructs
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikiversity.org_wiki_Exploring-5FSocial-5FConstructs&d=DwMGaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=fzw3Y-sK2iE13BXCwH0Y9_NYjZ4Uv_1cfhuyRWKk4yg&s=0aGLlWAFK-jBFGRNOFd4cNBKmVwsf2A_VNdoSLHPgQA&e=>
>> They often are the result of power struggles and can be far removed from
>> moral considerations.
>> Natural laws, in contrast, are often discovered by Physicists.
>> If you break a government law you go to jail. If you break a natural law,
>> you win a noble prize. Go figure!
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Lee Beaumont
>>
>> On Jan 13, 2022, at 5:56 AM, Henriques, Gregg - henriqgx <
>> [log in to unmask]> wrote:
>>
>> Love to see this discussion.
>>
>> A couple of quick thoughts.
>>
>> First, from a UTOK vantage point, values need to be recognized to
>> explicitly span across the psyche. Behavioral Investment Theory frames the
>> nervous system as an “investment value system”. Joining with John’s work,
>> we can frame it as a neurocognitive system that functions via recursive
>> relevance realization to realize the path of investment. So, we have the
>> animal-primate valuation process, again via John, framed by perspectival,
>> procedural and participatory knowing. Then we have justified values, in the
>> self-conscious propositional layer, which is what we use to explicitly
>> navigate the Culture-Person plane of existence.
>>
>> I generally see morals as the largest and most general justifiable
>> values. There are “conventional morals”, but I would just call them
>> conventions. My “Be that which enhances dignity and well-being with
>> integrity” was my ultimate moral-value justification.
>>
>> I see ethics as the process of making wise, intelligence morally
>> justified decisions that generate desired outcomes.
>>
>> Laws as the conventional rules enforced by a society to coordinate
>> behavior and legitimize punishment and control for violations.
>>
>> Great work Ali. The main piece is I want to emphasize here is that you
>> can get good mileage out of “lensing” these things thru the Animal-Mental
>> and Person-Culture planes of existence. I would say that Morals, Ethics,
>> and Laws have to be propositionally constituted by self-conscious Persons,
>> whereas values exist at the Mind dimension.
>>
>> Best,
>> Gregg
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* theory of knowledge society discussion <
>> [log in to unmask]> *On Behalf Of *Lene Rachel Andersen
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 12, 2022 11:35 PM
>> *To:* [log in to unmask]
>> *Subject:* Re: Clarification of Values, Morals, Ethics, and Laws
>>
>> *CAUTION: *This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links
>> or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is
>> safe.
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Dear Ali,
>>
>> Very good question, we are struggling with it too in the Bildung network:
>> what is the difference between values, morals, and personal emotional and
>> moral development and the ability to deliberately choose your commitment,
>> actions, viewpoints etc.?
>>
>> In the Bildung Rose https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bildungrose.com_&d=DwIFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=bZ1rl10R_rXQpAqOnKEndTJxaibpyk6y-zOZWBNJDnM&s=-bVeMq-fzH5O7ZJkBCNrjsnrEYNp3QxGi2f3mg__NNQ&e= 
>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bildungrose.com_&d=DwMDaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=Fmp7m_qBb3yqnShqMhSSroc5xgZQIUNN3ww09jvaxoA&s=P4EsycnRRsVIh361ZMBnnpRI7fj77fz1-SiVrJxO1Jc&e=>
>>  I distinguish between morals and ethics in the following way:
>>
>>    - Morals: the guidelines for proper behavior in familiar situations
>>    - Ethics: the principles behind the morals; what can guide us in
>>    unfamiliar situations
>>
>> With new technologies, morals are not enough, we need to consult our
>> ethics, because the new technologies create unfamiliar situations and
>> dilemmas.
>>
>> Am looking very much forward to other people's thinking regarding this.
>>
>> Warmly,
>>
>> Lene
>> On 13-01-2022 05:20, Alexis Kenny wrote:
>>
>> *CAUTION: *This email originated from outside of JMU. Do not click links
>> or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the content is
>> safe.
>> ------------------------------
>> Group,
>>
>> I'm writing up a newsletter about values that has absolutely sent me into
>> the weeds. I've spent entirely too much time (or not enough?) trying to
>> parse out definitions of and relations between values, morals, ethics, and
>> laws. I know Gregg has covered this content in a few spaces (which I tried
>> to follow).
>>
>> What was supposed to be a cushy topic review has become...something
>> entirely else. Ha! I would appreciate*ANY* feedback on the following
>> content (the bullets at the bottom are questions that came up for me as I
>> worked on this):
>>
>>
>> *VALUES.* Values are what we deem important and worthy in life; our own
>> personal platforms for making decisions. They inform how we spend their
>> time and energy. We often inherit values from our cultures, families of
>> origin, religious, political, or ideological persuasions, and then we add,
>> swap, and / or modify our values based on education, important life
>> experiences / commitments as we age. Principles are indisputable standards
>> that are more objective and can be applied across many spaces. So while
>> one’s personal values can be principles, principles are not always
>> individual values.
>>
>> *Example:* I value integrity, so I will pay for this medicine.
>>
>> *MORALS.* Values become morals through community consensus. Therefore,
>> the very process of creating one's own set of values is informed by the
>> moral system in which an individual exists. Morals, as stated, are the
>> systems of beliefs that emerge out of commonly shared core values. Virtues
>> are traits or qualities that are considered morally good within such
>> frames. Morals occur when entities interact and are often bound to cultural
>> spaces. Morals are context-driven and serve to regulate an individual’s
>> desire to be good (i.e., which, oftentimes, means the maintenance of social
>> connection with others).
>>
>> *Example: *It is bad for me to steal medicine (based on the value of
>> integrity).
>>
>> Moral dilemmas come about when shared moral codes come into conflict with
>> personal values. *Question:*Should I steal medicine if I can’t afford it
>> for my dying mother, but have access to the pharmacy storeroom? In this
>> scenario, one of my core values prohibits me from stealing. However, my
>> morality suggests that I should help my mother. Therefore, I might do the
>> wrong thing (stealing, as judged by my values) for the right reason (saving
>> my mother, as judged by my morals).
>>
>> *ETHICS.* Ethics are an institution's attempt to philosophically manage
>> behavior by offering guidelines based on a shared moral code. These are
>> standards that offer us reasoning regarding what behaviors are allowed and
>> what are not; what is “right” and “wrong.”
>>
>> *Example: *Because I violated my employer’s code of ethics (by stealing
>> medicine), I will be fired from my job.
>>
>> Ethical dilemmas occur when ethical codes come into conflict with a moral
>> system. *Question:* Should my employer not fire me because of my
>> personal circumstances? In this scenario, my company’s ethical code
>> prohibits me from stealing. However, my boss’s morality may suggest that he
>> take my context and upstanding personhood into consideration. Therefore, he
>> may do the right thing (let me keep my job, as judged by his morals) for a
>> non-compliant reason (not following guidelines, as judged by the
>> organization’s ethical code).
>>
>> *LAWS.* Laws are systematic rules that govern a particular body of
>> people. They are a set of regulations that are enacted by the government
>> and are punishable when violated. The intention of laws is to maintain
>> social order whereas ethics are meant to help people decide how to decide
>> to act.
>>
>> Example: I committed a misdemeanor by stealing medicine and will have to
>> pay a fine and potentially spend time in a local jail.
>>
>> Lawful dilemmas occur when governmental rules come into conflict with an
>> ethical code. *Question:* Should a courtroom judge not penalize me with
>> jail time because of my personal circumstances? In this scenario, the
>> judge’s lawfulness encourages her to punish me for a crime. However, the
>> judge’s ethical code may suggest that she take my context and upstanding
>> personhood into consideration. Therefore, she may do the right thing (have
>> me do community service, as judged by her ethics) for an unlawful reason
>> (not punishing me to the full extent of the law, as judged by our
>> government).
>>
>> In summary, it might be helpful for you to remember this content by using
>> the following mnemonic:
>>
>> Values provide
>> Morals guide
>> Ethics decide
>> Laws abide
>>
>> OR
>>
>> Values justify
>> Morals apply
>> Ethics comply
>> Laws stand by
>>
>> OR
>>
>> Values individually justify
>> Morals personally apply
>> Ethics communally comply
>> Laws governmentally stand by
>>
>>    - Values motivate while morals/ethics/laws restrain? Is this true?
>>
>>
>>    - Are there universal values, principles, morals, ethics, or laws?
>>
>>
>> Warmly,
>>
>> Ali
>>
>> P.S. So enjoying reading folks' responses to the Postmodernism thread.
>> Thanks for starting it Nicholas!
>>
>> --
>> *Alexis (Ali) Kenny*, PsyD, LP
>> Staff Psychologist
>> *LeaderWise
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>> --
>> *Lene Rachel Andersen*
>> Futurist, economist, author & keynote speaker
>> President of Nordic Bildung and co-founder of the European Bildung Network
>> Full member of the Club of Rome
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-- 
*Alexis (Ali) Kenny*, PsyD, LP
Staff Psychologist
*LeaderWise <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.leaderwise.org_ali-2Dkenny&d=DwIFaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=bZ1rl10R_rXQpAqOnKEndTJxaibpyk6y-zOZWBNJDnM&s=45sRaSYPP7SaD3ONmNkAXY5CElVN4jOHVnyMLHXCmiM&e= >*
email: [log in to unmask]
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