Tim:
The approach I take is (and I had thought) the *same* one taken by
Gregg -- which is to say the one put forward by Merlin Donald. He is
an evolutionary neuro-psychologist who is working with my Center.
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__en.wikipedia.org_wiki_Merlin-5FDonald&d=DwIBaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=jtGEWYngeGkLHbpF05r9EOzFOXrDYqAZf6kwj_zoHrc&s=rb0Iuiu_vOCGc7Bu3aATEPwe70hZGrXfXmx27c-a6b4&e=
His 1992 "Origins of the Modern Mind" -- which sharply distinguishes
"mimetic" from "mythic" cultures -- is a further elaboration of the
1976 Julian Jaynes "Origins of Consciousness." I was also Jaynes'
"last student."
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.amazon.com_Origins-2DModern-2DMind-2DEvolution-2DCognition_dp_0674644840&d=DwIBaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=jtGEWYngeGkLHbpF05r9EOzFOXrDYqAZf6kwj_zoHrc&s=9ReDL2pIk9yhs1Xyp2AA5RSDruPmvgwox8sh9YqihjA&e=https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.amazon.com_Origin-2DConsciousness-2DBreakdown-2DBicameral-2DMind_dp_0618057072&d=DwIBaQ&c=eLbWYnpnzycBCgmb7vCI4uqNEB9RSjOdn_5nBEmmeq0&r=HPo1IXYDhKClogP-UOpybo6Cfxxz-jIYBgjO2gOz4-A&m=jtGEWYngeGkLHbpF05r9EOzFOXrDYqAZf6kwj_zoHrc&s=Hauk9nsswBw-L3LLMnciM-smw6qtvEarRKDrKFAl5zM&e=
No I wasn't at Gregg's conference and if someone else has a different
view on this topic, which I've been studying for many years, I'd be
happy to take a look if you can provide a reference . . . !!
Mark
Quoting Tim Henriques <[log in to unmask]>:
> Hi Mark - I wanted to get clarification on the post you mentioned below
>
> Homo Sapiens did *not* have anything like human language as a direct
> result of its own biological evolution. From 200,000+ years ago until
> some time much more recently -- perhaps only 10,000+ years ago --
> humans most likely didn't have spoken language and written language is
> only 2500 or-so years old.
> Just to make sure I am reading that correctly, is the claim you are
> making that we didn't have spoken language 200k years ago or more?
>
>
> Did you happen to attend the ToK conference that Gregg held earlier
> this year? There was interesting presentation on Hunter Gatherer
> society as one of the main topics of a lecture, and in that
> presentation the presenter (Steve Keefer I believe) made that case
> that humans had reasonable working language at 600k years ago if my
> memory serves correctly. I am not an expert on this topic myself
> and so I can only relate the information presented. I imagine one
> of the points of contention is "what constitutes language". It was
> a subject I was interested in so I specifically asked about him
> about this and his basic point was that the hunter gather community
> could communicate quite well with each other and broader tribes.
> From a justification point of view they could ask each other "why
> did you do that" and then expect an answer. I asked him if that was
> more of his 'pet theory' or if there was reasonable consensus on
> that and he seemed to indicate the latter.
>
>
> Does that information jive with your account of history or do you
> take a different approach?
>
>
> Tim Henriques
> Director, NPTI VA/MD/DC
> 703-531-0795
> NPTI's Webpage
>
> Did you know I wrote a book about Powerlifting?
>
>
> Refer a friend to NPTI and receive a FREE CEU Class of your choice
> (including TRX and KB) if they sign up
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mark Stahlman <[log in to unmask]>
> To: TOK-SOCIETY-L <[log in to unmask]>
> Sent: Tue, Sep 25, 2018 5:48 pm
> Subject: Re: Stam's critique
>
> Gregg:
>
> As we've discussed, there is no simple "identity" between language
> and humans.
>
> Homo Sapiens did *not* have anything like human language as a direct
> result of its own biological evolution. From 200,000+ years ago until
> some time much more recently -- perhaps only 10,000+ years ago --
> humans most likely didn't have spoken language and written language is
> only 2500 or-so years old.
>
> Yes -- Merlin Donald is probably the best source on all this . . . !!
>
> Mark
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